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2014-04-14 Ingunn Sigurdsdatter - Norway Happiest Country on Earth Myth & Awakening the Norsemen (Red Ice Radio, Sweden, web page for this show here. (Includes download links for MP3 versions of the show). The complete show is also on YouTube here.

Transcript

Henrik Palmgren: Hey, everybody, welcome back, this is Henrik from Sweden. Thank you for tuning in today. You are of course listening to Red Ice Radio. Please check out our web sites redicecreations.com and redicemembers.com for much more.
We hear a lot about Norway in the most positive light in the international mass media these days as the globalists want to push a corporate socialist model upon the world. The Scandinavian experiment and the Nordic Model has certainly proven to fulfill many of the dreams that the New Word Order wants to impose on the world.
Astronomical taxes, systemic corruption, a controlled and one-sided media, a silent and submissive population, massive public spending, and in return we get lousy schools and health care not worth even mentioning. There is also within the system no room for alternatives and a few Mom and Pops as the corporate socialist model creates more monopolies and conformity than probably any other system has done throughout history.
We are talking with Ingunn Sigurdsdattur today who has been on the fringes of Norwegian society for some time now. A vantage point from where she can see the absurdity of the system and of course what happens if you do not obey and submit to the state. She has a university degree in languages and social sciences. Living in various countries has provided a track record of conventional as well as not so conventional careers within different areas. She has founded and cofounded three companies, taught at the local university and high schools, and was last running an alternative school in her home town. She has also co-authored a book for children about Thor Heyerdahl’s crossing of the Pacific Ocean in a balsa fleet.
We will be discussing the modus operandi of the underling nefarious quality of the much praised Scandinavian social democracies. The engineering of our mind constructs through media and other institutions and the limits to statism. This is an extended two hour segment, and in the second hour we will speak more about when the Norwegian police showed up at her door with the equivalent of the Food Safety Agency in order to stifle her economically, basically. We will get into some of the history of the Scandinavian countries towards the end as well as this is where the key lies both to why we have been so fiercely opposed and sought to be controlled like no other. But it is in the history that the secret to our rebellion also lies.
Hi, Ingunn, thanks for coming on to our program, talking with us today. Is everything OK on your end?
Ingunn Sigurdsdatter: Hi there Henrik, yes, absolutely, thank you so. I am Skyping you from the studio of Michael’s Round Table Talk, near Oslo, near the Norwegian capitol. What I see around me is an impressive sound studio, actually, and Michael’s art work on the walls. Just like me we are actually two people in the studio today with you. So like me, Michael is also dedicating most of his time and his efforts and whatever money he might have to waking the people up in times where we see the totalitarian society come closer by the day. So--
HP: Indeed
IS: As for me, I have not bought clothes for three or four years. And when I look at Mike, I think that might be the case also for him. Yes.
HP: Hi Mike, thank you for joining us as well.
Michael: Hello, Henrik.
HP: Hey, nice to talk to you, nice to meet you. Well, I think we have a real interesting discussion ahead of us here today. Before we get more into the situation in Norway as well regarding freedom of speech --I mean there are so many issue we can and want to talk about, and we will see how much we can kind of cram into it here -- maybe you can just tell us a little bit about yourself, Ingunn, and how there is an interesting situation that has occurred to you obviously, and we will get into this more later in detail, but we are going to try to tackle this very notion as well that Norway is the best country in the world. The world’s happiest place to live in. This is something that gets repeated again and again in the mass media, and you know there are some interesting numbers we can dig out on that as well. But just tell us a little bit about yourself, Ingunn.
IS: I will just give you a general background so you have an idea. So as for me I feel that I have been descending the social ladder rather than climbing it actually. So I feel I began on the top pretty much, and after that I have come climbing down for the last few years. So I grew up in a politically conscious family, and my grandfather, he was the head of the leftist party. So he was actually a renown politician. Careerwise I have been teaching at the local university and at high schools and I have founded and co-founded three companies and at least one of them with a fair measure of worldly success. So but what I do now is the contrary. I am cleaning houses, for instance. I have turned in my Norwegian citizenship so I have become what some might call a free woman, which rather is just returning to the natural sovereign state without any tags, really. So what I live by now is my ecological green economy which the state is very happy to label "black," black money, but as far as me is concerned, I would say it is the black economy that the state promotes exclusively.
HP: Right.
IS: So when I think about the things that I do now, actually, I think it is so sweet because the allegory fits my life so nicely. So Shakespeare, he says that all the men and women are merely players on the stage, right? There is only one person who is outside this matrix who is not in the game, and that is the cleaning lady because she comes on to the stage when the actors have gone home and she sweeps the stage and cleans up after them. So that is actually me now. But if you go to the Norwegian media you will have to look hard and long to find someone more demonized than me because I have been visible within the media for the last years, as a very critical voice of dissent. [7:06]
HP: Tell us how that happened, how that occurred and why they –- because usually what happens in Sweden and some of the other countries here they just do not kind of touch those issues at all. They just avoid it altogether. Were you kind of in the media limelight before you started on your awakening journey, if we can call it that?
IS: Absolutely, I was on my awakening journey. Then it was during the swine flu period that I was kind of launched on to the national stage. But it is as you say, we had to ambush the media and use strategies to come on to the national media actually to be heard at all. So once you are heard, well, special things happen to you. That is kind of how it started. During the swine flu media some of us became very visible, and then it has escalated from there. Now we have a few voices or a few people that are commonly known. I would say nationally, more or less, people recognize our names and they know that we actually have a position of dissenters or nonconformists.
HP: Yes.
IS: Michael is absolutely one of them.
HP: Very good, now I wanted to ask you as well before we get deeper into this then just a little about the media environment because obviously we have a personal experience of yours we are going to relate a little bit later. But I think according to the World Happiness Index, I think that is what it is called, it is actually a study being done by the Legatum Institute, it is a globalist think tank, pretty much. One of the spear-heading gentlemen there is Jeffrey Gedmin from the Athens Institute and Counsel on Foreign Relations and some of the other interesting neocon connections he has,. He has released his index and they, the Legatum Institute continues to put Norway on the number one spot and there, and are a couple of parameters for this, for example the economic situation. There is the so-called "happiness question," but also "freedom of the press" and "freedom of expression" and "freedom of speech" and everything else. If the situation is the same as it is in Sweden, we certainly do not have a free press. We have a state-subsidized press, one that does not bite the hand that feeds it. The critique is very, very nominal. So an extension to this is of course that when this indexing think tank comes along to ask people in Norway for example about questions like, “How corrupt do you perceive your politicians or your political system to be?” usually that scores pretty fairly low because people are not aware of it because an indication of this is that the press has to first of all talk about these issues so that people are aware of how corrupt it is. That is the situation I feel in Sweden. Would you say it is very similar in Norway?
IS: Yes, absolutely, and that is what we will be talking about basically because projected to us you will see that there is the image that we live in the best country in the world, and that our people are the happiest on the planet, and then occasionally you have polls and you have statistics that try to embed these facts into our minds so we will never forget. So if you ask any Norwegian, they have some kind of automatized repeat button, and they will tell you just how wonderful our country is. But it --
HP: It is a default answer, right? You get a default answer from the person you are talking with.
IS: Exactly, because the image projected to us is so easy to feel the logical dissonance and to feel that something is not quite right, and that is what we will be touching upon. And this is very painful actually for the Norwegian people, and what we experience these days is the pains of waking up and many people right now see their illusions crumbling, which is very painful. But before getting more into that, if it is all right by you I just want to clarify a little more about my positions.
HP: Sure
IS: Actually what I wanted most of all was possibly to conclude right away just to insure the conclusion does not get lost in the details, because as it is, we have a very clear image of what is wrong with our countries. I would for one possibly like to be able to describe it quite precisely. So what I feel or what I actually know is that we the people in the Scandinavian countries, we have been subjected to a scam that runs so deep that it is very hard to grasp. So what we see is that George Orwell’s Animal Farm has been created within a format that could be called the welfare state, right?
HP: Right.
IS: That is exactly how it is. And then the objective, the real objective, has been to capitalize to the max on the human resource and at the same time all kinds of techniques of social engineering are being actively employed. So each time we show nonconformity behavior they come along with some instruments to prod us and to get us back in line.
HP: Yes.
IS: So actually what we think of as the government, because we think we have a government and that we are a sovereign nation state, but my finding is that these governments are actually nothing more than just platforms. The purpose is to ease the corporatization of everything that can be sold. So our names, our birth certificates, our DNA, our signatures, everything can be sold. As I said, this is the purpose of governments. The government is in itself is a corporation with owners.
HP: Yes. Well --
IS: And --
HP: Sorry to interrupt, but I have to chime in there. There is something I have seen as well that the lingo, the language of that, that comes with the welfare state has been a scam to begin with. We see nothing for it practically. I mean, people have to question the services that they get in return for the alleged services provided by the government. What I have not understood is that people continue to return to it as a safety mechanism because they are scared to a certain extent to be on their own, left on, they are not going to be left on the outside, but that seems to be kind of a perception within the Nordic states, that it is: “Ohhh, it is very important, you know, it is all about security and safety and that the government is there like your Mommy and Daddy and capture you in case something happens.” But if something happens, it is very easy to slip through the cracks because that system is an illusion there to begin with.
IS: Exactly, and you know it is done very cleverly too because in Norway and also in Sweden and in Denmark we have beautiful nature landscapes. Especially Norway which is a very small and thinly inhabited country. People love the nature, so do I. I love my country and we have a feeling of closeness to nature so what the state has done or what has been done has been kind of to create a kind of association between everything we love and the state.
HP: Yes.
IS: Like creating your own little pathways. When we think of the state we automatically think of everything we love like the nature, so you know when someone comes along to criticize the state, people they feel almost grief because it is as if they are losing everything.
HP: Oh, it is a personal attack. You know? [15:11]
IS: Yes, it is. So it is as you say there is no way for most people they can not even begin to conceive how life would be without the state because we have been born into the social contract indoctrinated quite heavily since we were small.
HP: Yes.
IS: We just haven’t known that it has been indoctrination. We have thought that we have a free country and that the things we learn in school are accurate and represent reality in a very good way, but actually it has been indoctrination. Some people begin to realize that, but it is painful.
HP : Well, indeed. And Mike, let us know if you want to chime in and have anything to add to this as well. Feel free to just jump into the discussion, OK?
Michael: I do agree very much with the idea of the Animal Farm. Norwegian socialization is the absolute best well-kept Animal Farm in this district.
HP: Yes, yes, I could not agree more. It is a political laboratory. It has been very easy because I think of the trust in all. There are a couple of professors in Sweden as well, specifically a guy called Lars Trägårdh who they wheel out every time they talk about anything that is Swedish. For example we had that piece, I don’t know if you guys read that in The Guardian by Michael Booth, basically that attacked the Scandinavian countries and the model. [Ed. Note: He probably means the article "Dark lands: the grim truth behind the 'Scandinavian miracle,'" by Michael Booth, The Guardian, Monday 27 January 2014.] I mean, I was very, to the first initial extent I was glad to see that, but on second side of it I was also disappointed to see that the critique was kind of misappropriated. It was directed in the wrong kind of places to a certain extent, but nonetheless they wheeled out Lars Trägårdh who detailed this afterwards in The Guardian, and basically defending the system, and saying that, “No, it is not a totalitarian state. This is all voluntary. People are agreeing to it.” [Ed. Note: See "The grim truth behind the Scandinavian miracle' – the nations respond" by Michael Booth, Adam Price, Agnes Bolsø, Eirikur Bergmann, Alexander Stubb and Lars Tragardh, The Guardian, 5 Feb 2014], But my point has always been that the social environment that exists here, the social engineering partitioned with the education system, the fact that at least in Sweden home schooling has been banned. It is incredibly homogenized and this kind of image is being built of how you are supposed to be, and if you break that mold, if you fall out on the outside of that, you really feel how narrow it is very quickly and also then it is totalitarian in nature, you know?
Michael: Not only that, but it describes mediocracy.
HP: Yes, yes.
Michael: It is simply mediocracy. And if you are an extremist, that also means you are bad when it also can mean you are extraordinary.
HP : Exactly, exactly. It works both ways. You have the crab mentality where basically no one can escape or do something different and come out of that. But go ahead, Ingunn.
IS: Yes, so actually if you read it is interesting what you said because my impression is that when you read the works of people like Bertrand Russell and Aldus Huxley, the Brave New World and George Orwell also, they have a futuristic vision of what the scientifically-created society would be. I think that what you see in the Scandinavian countries is exactly this. So you see all the mechanisms in place for eroding family life and how the woman and everyone is asked to identify with serving the state. [18:40]
HP: Yes.
IS: The maximal goal in life, actually.
HP: That is right.
IS: And the state will care for your children.
HP: [Laughter]
IS: So you can see, what I think is that the Scandinavian countries must have been consciously chosen to see what can be created in terms of turning us into submissive slaves.
HP: Yes. [19:09]
IS: And what is also true is that one of the mechanisms that they use is to have a huge state administration so that half of the people can work for the state and their job will be to control the rest.
HP: Exactly.
IS: So we keep each other in place.
HP: Exactly, that is very well put. It is a kind of self-policing -- it is not a police state as you would think of it because the existence for the militarized police, you know, the full on guards out there with tasers and acoustic weaponry and everything, that is not needed because the population police each other. Right? It is a perfect efficient system in that way. But it is very important in what you bring up in that dependency on the state as well. I think in Denmark that over 50%, well, I know that the state is the largest employer. But one thing that usually people miss as well is that one of the reasons for the success economically, and we don’t have to look at Norway’s oil resources as of yet [laughter], but the fact is that it has been built on at least about a hundred years of free market before the ideas of Folkhemmet the socialist kind of environment came into place. That is why we saw a crash in Sweden back in the 90’s because it was basically, it managed to perpetuate itself just for so long before it actually crashed. I think one of the reasons why Norway has survived is because of the oil funds and can still do the same behavior, if you know what I mean. [20:29]
IS: Exactly, that is exactly what is happening. But you know, our countries are very confusing because, yes, they can still lean on the relative riches or the relative welfare that they are able to muster, but the thing is that we feel or what we see is a very subtle form of totalitarianism because there is a stark contrast between the façade and the actual things that the governments do. So it is very confusing, it is like dealing with Hannibal Lecter. [21:11] It is like you have smooth operations on the surface and then you see that Norway promotes itself as the peace negotiating and peace keeping country, the kind of, on top of the hierarchy of countries with very noble intentions. So we are very big on promoting ourselves as the most humanitarian country in the world and the nicest people. And we are also taught regularly that we are a nation of good people and we are actually the best in the world at many things.
HP: Yes.
IS: But then, at the same time, there is a darker side because it is also reflected in the numbers. And I will get back to some of the numbers. But you will see that we are engaged very heavily in military operations in countries where we really have no business. And the basis for our participation in Libya and such, it is based on the thinnest public discourse you would ever see. You hardly need any arguments at all because people are used to thinking that our government is good and it has noble intentions.
HP: Yes.
IS: And it is all right, they can just go to war, it doesn’t matter. So even if people realize that, OK, one million people were killed in Iraq due to our interventions, and we spent billions and billions on aircraft bombing Libya, there is no connection made in the mind that creates a crack in your perception of what the state is.
HP: Yes.
IS: You see the public pension fund, that we have very good feelings for it because we think that this is our national pride and are saving us. And then when you see where they invest the public pension funds, it is into the most nefarious corporations you could ever think of. So this pension fund that is referred to all the time and that is supposed to support us into the future is kind of leaving a trail of unimaginable brutality behind, and destruction. And also among people they will feel that the state more and more comes down with an iron fist.
HP: Yes
IS: And you see ways of stupid force [sp?, heard correctly?] I think this is what she said, not sure] it in a way that we have not seen before, because this has been an innocent country. [23:57] So we can see that the public discourse is hardening and that the grip is tightening. Which is also why many more people are awakening because the state is becoming more and more brutal in an open way, actually
HP: Which is a good thing, you know, ultimately. Let me just ask you quickly before we leave the government pension fund because this is actually the Petroleum Fund of Norway, correct? It is the same one, right?
IS: Yes, that is the one. It is now called the Pension Fund because it has a good name.
HP: A good name, exactly, because now they cannot associate, you know, oil, petroleum has obviously been demonized around the world to all the environmentalists and everything else. You can’t mention anything about that, right. You can’t face reality, the fact that, yes, we use petroleum people, just get over it. Or lets bring on a new energy device to the market here. But nonetheless, surplus oil money then goes into this one. It is holding, I believe, 1% of the global equity markets, this fund, which is huge. I mean it is the largest stockowner in Europe, and this began, I think Norway discovered oil a little bit earlier, but it started around the late 60’s, ’69, ’70's, this is when this began. One of my questions has always been, if this is such an incredible huge fund, why does Norway not pay off its debt, for example? Norway still has about 30% of GDP debt. This means that this is something they could actually sort out with this fund and actually make sure that all the money that is brought in is something that is from scratch. They don’t owe the IMF anything, but they don’t do that. But people also have a perception that the Sovereign Wealth Fund or the Government Pension Fund is going to be distributed among the Norwegians. We, you all have a piece of it, right? You are all going to be rich some day. You are going to get a hand out from the government. This is never going to happen, right?
IS: No. It is never going to happen, and there is some kind of rule, an action rule they call it, that permits them to use, I think it is 4% of the income of the pension fund each year on the population. So what is obvious to most people, because we have this notion of us being the richest country in the world, is when you look to health care and when you look to public schooling and such, you will see what happens to all the money, where do they go? Because you cannot find them. You cannot see the traces of this distribution of wealth actually among the people. You can’t see that the infrastructure is getting better. What you see is the contrary. Everything is deteriorating. So what I think about the public fund is more that it is used as an investment platform for corporate forces. We are told that we have an annual return of I think it is like 13% of the investments we make every year. 13% is very little. If you are into investing in the stock market, and especially into the types of corporations that the public investment funds invest into, then you would expect a much larger return. So my impression is that this is a kind of pool of money and a platform for investments that kind of is one example of many of the transfer of wealth from the grass roots and to the oligarchical forces in Europe.
HP: Yes, yes.
IS: My impression is that this is what we see. We see a looting of the people. We see that we lose everything, and that is dependency. We are told that we are a rich country but this is actually just an illusion because where is the money? We don’t see the money.
HP: Well, exactly. I wonder if it is a slush fund. I mean ultimately it is Norges Bank investment management that controls the fund, the Norwegian Central Bank in this case. You know, who is on the board there? Where does this actually go? People are way too naïve in the Scandinavian countries and think that there is nothing, there is no corruption going on. There are not people who line their own pockets. The fact is the corruption is so brilliantly veiled in obscurity by the government that, and that also is why you don’t hear a lot of loud voices out there in Scandinavian countries speaking up and talking about this, and even if they were speaking up, there would not be a media environment for them to speak up in. So the rest of the world has an opinion that “Oh my God, it has got to be great, right? They are doing something right because I don’t hear any critique."
Michael: The Norwegian bank and the oil department are actually registered on the New York Stock Exchange.
HP: Yes.
Michael: So these are corporative essences. They don’t have anything to do with governments.
HP: Yep.
IS: When we spoke about the purpose of government as a platform for corporatization of everything that can be sold, actually, I think that might be a central point because the point seems to be how can we make the most, how can we capitalize the most on the resources that are available to us. So what is happening is that in the same way as property can be sold, countries can also be sold, and assets within it. And the assets within it is actually you and me and our productive capacity. So what I think is that Norway is owned by someone, which is why we see the looting of the country, right?
HP: Yes.
IS: So in order for the government to obtain new loans, because it is ridiculous actually that Norway has foreign, or that they have loans. But that is how it works, how the scam works, actually, when you understand the scam and the deeper structures of the scam. So to be able to obtain new loans the government can lien anything. That is what politics these days is actually about. I think that I that in Sweden you had a case of Øresund. The bridge of Øresundsbroen?
HP: Yes.
IS: The bridge at Øresund was liened to obtain a 120 billion loan, wasn’t it?
HP: I believe so, yes.
IS: But there has been very little in the media about that. So what we see is that the apex of the financial industry, the banks and such, they are actually trading in all kinds of securities that can be sold and rehypothecated and rolled over until it all blows up in our faces. What you can see around us is that among our European brothers and sisters it has already has blown up in their faces, right? You can see that from the demonstrations in Spain, for instance, and there is no coverage of this in our media. So what we actually see I think in our times, which is why it is so important for us to speak out, which is why Mike and me do the work we do, is that we see a very hasty transfer of wealth from the grass roots. So to sum it up, this is what you see. You see the politics these days seem to be about getting the signature, getting someone to sign so that you can have transfer of wealth into the hands of an oligarchy. That is basically the banks, actually. There are very few corporations that control the world. And this is happening so quickly. The pension fund is also used as such instruments. What we see is that all of our natural resources are privatized and sold. The water is becoming privatized, the electricity has been, which is kind of our national gold. So everything that we used to think was sovereign values, everything can now be securitized and sold on the open market. This looting of our countries, which will be leaving us without much, which will be actually sending us back into poverty. And this is happening in Europe. This is the reason for us now reacting and asking the people, “Please wake up and please realize for once what is going on.” Secondly what you are consenting to because this can only happen through your consent.
HP: Yes.
IS: So if you wake up and see through this game, and that is a very good vantage point for taking our powers back and our future back. [33:10]
HP: I just want to comment on that too because just what you mentioned is absolutely true about the selling of the public assets. Then another fallacy on top of is that people mistake that for being free market, or so-called capitalism, when for example we had a guest on who actually was one of the persons that visited the Bank of International Settlements, those meetings in Basel, Joan Veon. We still have that in the archives for people. But she brought this up and talked about what is known as public, private, partnership, PPP. This is the selling of public assets. And then you have of course a few people from within government, for example, those on the board, on a company that actually managed to get the contracts to purchase these assets. So you have very few people controlling it, and the company though is still under the management of government, they are still under the restrictions and rules set by government, so there are going to be tariffs and fees there, so it is win-win situation where governments still can kind of by proxy controls it, but you have a small amount of private people who can own the assets and make money on it, but the government makes money on it as well. So again it this perfect merger of two different systems that seemingly would clash and clash, but the fact is they have managed to pull this off with public, private partnership. So it is not free market, and it has nothing to do with that.
IS: No, it is not at all free market. In no way. But my impression is even maybe more radical than yours, but I might be wrong, but my impression is definitely that the banks own us and that a scam was pulled where we went bankrupt in the 30’s after the general bankruptcy in ’29 and we were forced into agreements with the banks. When we then became illiquid after that we became the property of the banks. So what I think is that what we think of as our nations are owned by the banks. The banks own us and control us and we can see that also from documentation. It is very easy to see how the European central banks through Basel and through the Basel 1, 2, 3 --
HP: Yes
IS: Have a stranglehold on regulation and this is absorbed into Norwegian law as passed and passed for Norwegian law, but has nothing to do with Norwegian law at all. But from documentation that we have seen from the World Bank, we can clearly see that the Norwegian central bank is an account in the World Bank, and that the World Bank is also owned by the Basel. This is the apex of the forces that run us. And to be able to pull this scam, to pull this illusion of freedom while we really are slaves, just in modern form, it is as if they had to create something called the welfare state and something that pretends as the sovereign state and where you have illusions of real politicians having real power. But when you look to the legislative powers which are the expression of the people or are supposed to be in the so-called democratic countries, then you see that they have no power any more. None at all. So also gradually the sovereign powers have been signed off. Now the people, when they go to the election polls, and they choose between the area of parties that they think will make change politically, what they don’t know really is that there is no representation any longer within the government and the Constitution is by no means upheld.
HP: Yes.
IS: They really don’t realize how much of our sovereignty has been signed off.
HP: Yes, and you guys in Norway are still not part of the European Union but you have tons of economic agreements with them which still you are really under the thumb of the European Union anyway, so it is another illusion, basically.
IS: Yes, because you know, if you count the laws, because the sole purpose of the parliament is to legislate, to give laws, and then you actually expect the laws to come to us, to the people, and are filtrated down through the system come from the Parliament. But then if you go to the database where there is something called law data [sp?], then you can actually count the laws and compare the laws and see how many laws were there before the European Union and how many laws are there now, and how many laws have come from the European Union. So then when you count the laws you actually see that, I would say 95% of all of our legislation comes from the European Union. It is funny because Norway is the country that is the most loyal to the European Union and 99.7[%] of the directives which are called laws that we get from the European Union are passed as laws or as directives, statutes. So I think that this, the image promoted to us of who we are, is as you say. We are told we are the most proper people, good in hygiene, good in keeping the rules, good in conforming, and the purpose of conforming is that we show solidarity towards one another. So we have these standards of conduct that make us into very obedient slaves, actually. And actually make us proud when we can say, “Oh, we are conforming very nicely to the standards presented by the EU and such.”
HP: [Laughter]. Well, this is positive reinforcement training. You do the same with dogs. Well done, little boy, here you go, here is a treat, you know, well done. It is absolutely the same thing, and it is done on very, very base level. But the fact is that this as well to reemphasize that point, this is a successful system that has been put in place when the globalist meeting takes place and when, what is the Prime Minister over there in Norway again called, his name Stoltenberg, right? When he goes to the World Bank meetings and all the other economic meetings around in Europe and promotes the Nordic model as, this is like, you should start looking at this now, because this, ladies and gentlemen, this is it, we have it! We have found it. We know how to control them. The question of course is if this is going to be successfully, actually applied to other populations. There is a lot that speaks against that, but nonetheless, I think a tweaking, a subtle change in adaptation to other cultures and other nations might able to be a successful task for them to actually create that totalitarian state that also Huxley talked about. That people are going to love their servitude, that actually want it, we need it, you know?
IS: It is also cracking up. We can see that it is cracking up and I think that is unexpected for our governing forces. So if you want to, maybe we can touch a little upon the means of control that they actually use to keep us in line.
HP: Yes, certainly.
IS: Yes, because it is very interesting. It is so fascinating that people don’t see through this, the techniques, because you can very well see techniques of mind control and social engineering techniques are being used on you. So maybe we can begin a little with the media because the media is the primary tool used to keep us in check, in shocking ways, very often actually. So what we see is that in order to keep us in place, they need to have the media as a tool to kind of fixate a world view and also make opposition impossible because if you oppose then you are hanged out to dry in front of the whole nation. So what they need is a very narrow world view that can easily be controlled.
HP: And you felt this, sorry to interrupt, but you felt this first hand because you have been appointed to be that kind of person in certain settings, right? When you talk negatively about the vaccinations for example, or anything else, where you basically break the mold of the established view on any issue, really, you have for a little bit been the go-to person, so you have experienced that first hand of how it is to be put on the outside and basically ridiculed on that level, correct?
IS: Very much. What they do primarily when you get out out of line and want to take the conversation or discourse into another direction is that they start tagging you and name-calling you, kind of based on advanced rules which are trauma-based mind control. So when you have a trauma that is deeply embedded in the minds of the people, in the psyche, such as the Holocaust, the Norwegian killings at UtØya in 2011, when you actually hint to these events, and associate them to your name, then people are immediately repulsed. So if you speak against the government you will immediately be called an anti-Semite
HP: Yep
IS: Or on the other hand they will be hinting that OK, you are supporting Anders Behring Breivik.
HP: Yes, I know, that is funny.
IS: And checkmate and then you are just expelled from the game.
HP: Right.
IS: And you are placed under the radar of the national NSA and registered on their list as promoting hatred.
HP: Sure, oh yes, yes.
IS: Even if what you really promoted, what I am promoting and all the people like me is the opposite. We promote no wars, no killings, no GMO’s, no pesticides. So what the governments do is actually play us like fiddles through the emotional programming we were filled up with since we were children. But it is interesting to see because you touched briefly upon that, and the tools that you use, the state uses some agencies to promote the scientific world view such as the human ethical society for instance. They also pay a wide range of Internet trolls and bloggers, right?
HP: Sure.
IS: Yes, so these so-called humanist organizations are very much related to these more militant arms of the skeptic societies. So what we see is that they actually place university professors in strategic positions, and then they can just pretend to represent the expertise and will always be called upon if the media needs an opinion from someone, they will always call upon these. So they have a list of people that they always call, right? [45:28]
HP: Oh, definitely, exactly.
IS: And they can be relied upon because they will kind of instill the established consensus within the people and they will never speak wrong words.
HP: And that is another culture. We have talked about that before on the program on our series we have done on Sweden, specifically. But this again is very much incorporate all of the Nordic countries, really, but just this idea of the collective identification within each individual. I mean, I would argue that there isn't such a thing as an individual within the Nordic model, or within the Scandinavian society at large, but nonetheless there is a way that you always seek external verification for something. If something happens, you know, you wait for the expert to come on to the TV and tell you what to think about issue A or B. It is very much a non-engaging kind of process that people who are involved in where they basically wait for the external authority to tell them either what to do or how to react or what to think about something, and it is very easily absorbed and there is no thinking or no processing further of that. I am not really sure yet how they have managed to create that kind of person, but it seems to be pretty much like 99% of the population, if even maybe more, are like that, and then there are a few people like yourself who see through this and have managed to speak up in some manner against that, you know.
IS: I can never really understand how it is possible for the people not see these connections because we have some incidents such as the swine flu outbreak. These incidents alone would be enough to tear the paradigm wide open if the people could realize what really happened. Because you know, when the swine flu broke out, the coverage in the Norwegian media was unanimously urging you to take the vaccine. There was not even one medical doctor who came to voice a dissent. Everywhere you would find little posters in the schools and in the government agencies urging you to take the vaccines. So when we translated the investigation of Jane Burgermeister it was blatantly obvious that a scam was being forced upon us. We had access to all kinds of scientific reports readily available to anyone and telling you quite clearly of the dangers of narcolepsy. So what we did was we formed an action group and we went on to national television and we told the people this is going to happen. If you take this vaccine you might have narcolepsy because it has happened before in the States in '76, and it is also a known danger of squalene, one of the adjuvants of the vaccine. So we, the lay people, normal people from the street, we knew all of this, and we could refer to scientific reports. The state-authorized panel of experts, they said, “No, no, the vaccine is absolutely safe,” and they knew nothing of this. So what happened was exactly as we predicted, that a number of children now suffer and they have their lives ruined from this, from the narcolepsy. So the one conclusion that you have to draw is that we do have a government that is willing to inflict suffering and pain upon the people on purpose to serve their corporate masters. There is no other conclusion to be drawn. So I just can’t see how can people live with these conclusions and still think everything is OK.
HP: Well I think it is a very deep, not only subconscious identification with authority but just something they even consciously know that if you have lived your life, or you have used the state or government authority as the crutches to your own life, if you are to remove those, if you are to expose those for the lies that they are, the fact that they don’t have your best interests at heart, they don’t give a sh*t about you, if you come to that realization, that would mean that the way that you have lived your life and the way you have supported yourself for all that time is going to crumble underneath you and you are literally not going to be able to stand on your own feet, or your own legs because of that. You won’t be able to carry your own weight. So it is that dependency I think that is so dangerous, and again, I think that is why from a psychological point of view they have pushed the idea of security and safety and this is going to be something that is external to you. It is not something where you are your own master of your own life, you rule yourself, you judge yourself, you make your own decisions, but it is always completely external and therefore they defend the state because they are in fact the state. [50:36]
IS: Exactly. Sometimes I think that it is as if the population is suffering from the Stockholm Syndrome where you actually love your abuser.
HP: Yes.
IS: Because so many people are so scared of waking up because they might even perceive that there is a contrast between what we are told and what really is. So it is so scary for them to wake up. What they often say to me, they kind of cling to the illusion that at least things are better in Norway than in the rest of the world.
HP: [Laughter] Yes.
IS: They tell me "Would you rather live in Somalia or some place like that?" And then they are happy. So they are happy with the minimum. But one very confusing point is that the politicians that we see, the visible ones, they are nice people, and we can readily identify with them. We also can see the King, he is going for walks in the forest and he is a nice person. And then it is so subtle. The scam is so subtle, because you kind of sense that these can’t be the people in charge, which they aren’t, basically.
HP: Exactly.
IS: Yes, so the puppet-masters that actually pull the threads of the marionettes, we don’t see them.
HP: That’s right.
IS: What we see is the external realities. We can’t dig any deeper than what we see on the surface. Probably that is because we see that the Prime Minister is a very nice person, she really is, and so it is easy to feel trust.
Michael: Erma Solberg is now the Prime Minister of Norway
HP: Oh, so you guys have a new one?
IS: Yes.
HP: So there was a recent election then?
Michael: Stoltenberg, the worker party, lost the election to the right wing party
HP: And how right wing is that right wing party, because if it is as it is in Sweden, then the moderates, they are the new working party, they are just the same as the Social Democrats. Is it the same in Norway?
IS: Exactly.
Michael: Well, yes, I think so.
HP: [Laughter]
IS: It is exactly the same.
HP: It is a fraud. I mean, they are not conservative. There isn’t any Conservative Party in the Nordic countries.
Michael: And now the ex-Prime Minister from Norway, Stoltenberg, is the Secretary for NATO.
HP: Ah, OK, so he took over the role of the previous Dane, what is his name, again? He was the head of NATO for a while there.
Michael: It is a swing door policy.
HP: Interesting. It is a lot of northerners that have become the heads of NATO. That is very, very interesting, of course because they are promoting peace and neutrality, right? Sweden is the biggest munitions manufacturing per capita in the world, so there you have that. But --
IS: I thought that was us. So that is you! [Laughter].
Michael: I think Norway is gaining on Sweden there.
HP: On weapons manufacturing?
IS: Yes.
HP: Oh really?
Michael: The boats maker [sp?] hyperexclusive …
HP: Interesting. Yes, well maybe you are. The latest statistics I read, Sweden was still pretty much number one, but that was a couple of years ago, so maybe that has changed now. That is interesting.
Michael: I also do believe that we make DU ammunition in Norway.
HP: Depleted uranium?
Michael: Yes.
HP: Well that would be interesting. Are you guys shipping that in from somewhere or are you using the nuclear waste?
Michael: I used to be an advertising photographer. I had them as my client once. They do advanced stuff. I have heard from people in the military that have family working there that say, yes, they do produce DU ammunition.
HP: Wow, all right. That is interesting. Now guys, I think we should take a little short break here in a while. We want to give out some details and stuff before we do. I just want to say that Norwegians, Swedes, Danes, Finns, Icelanders, you name it, need to find the pulse of their ancestors again and find some heroism, some brave tendencies and learn to identify what it really used to be as part of these countries, and step away from this idea that there is an identification with the state and that the state rules over you as a subject to it. I think it is really important time to do that, because otherwise this is going to be completely lost. The control is so adamant at this stage. But as you said, nonetheless Ingunn, you said that very eloquently that as the iron fist becomes more obvious, as the control grip gets tighter, there are more and more people that are beginning to wake up from that. So that is something that we do have to work in our advantage, if you will.
IS: Absolutely. And I think that is what makes this possible is the growing spirituality that you can see in belonging to explore our background. Could be within the Viking mythology but also generally you see the growing spirituality, and as for me it is the universe that has held me through this. [55:49]
HP: Yep, yep, very good. Now, yes, let’s give out some details, guys. Ingunn, you set up the web site. I don’t know how long you have been running it, but please give us the URL for that so people know where to go. Is that primarily in Norwegian or is it some English writing you have there as well?
IS: So sorry, but it is just in Norwegian. As it is, we will be translating it as soon as we can. But for the record it is Sigurdsdatter.com.
HP: Oh boy, do you want to spell that for us, or should I link that up for people who want to find that?
IS: It is my last name, actually.
HP: Yes.
IS: Sigursdatter.com
HP: It is S-i-g-u-r-d-s-d-a-t-t-e-r.com. OK, we will have that up. Mike, do you have a web site that you want to give out?
Michael: No web site. The only thing I have is blogtalkradio which is called Michael’s Round Table Talk, that has a facebook page. [56:50]
HP: We are talking with Ingunn Sigurdsdatter about Norway, the happiest place in the world. And of course breaking down the myth that Norway is one of the best countries to live in, in the world. One conclusions, though, of this is that if Norway is the best place in the world, then we are in deep trouble, and we have not managed to achieve much. In fact, this would be a that the prison planet is well under way and that conformity and control is the main objective. That is kind of some of the things we will talk about here in the second hour as well as we get deeper into the experiment, the political laboratory that has been the Nordic countries and Scandinavia. But Ingunn, I want to ask you more about what actually happened to you. We have not got into this yet. The cops came knocking on your door. I mean this is something, as you have started to feel now as an “outsider,” I guess to a certain extent, of how easy it is for you to navigate in Norwegian society now when you have kind of tried to set yourself outside it basically, because you know as we have been talking about before, Norwegian and Swedish and Danish society, Finnish and Icelandic too to an extent, is all about conformity. If you bump up against those edges of the play pen of the country you feel pretty darn quick how limited we are really. So tell us what happened to you, and give us that story, Ingunn. [58:09]
IS: Yes, I will. I will also give you a little background on why I became sovereign. But before that I will tell you an actual story, and what led up to it. Because what I did was that I turned in my citizenship and I didn’t have to do it with bravado or with commotion. But I actually did it. So technically it would have been enough to tell the government or the administration that there had been a mistake since they seem to assume that there existed some contract between us. But what I wanted to do was with my example to inspire other people, actually to try to contribute to reducing the crimes committed by the state and creating awareness around these matters. So what I did was I went to the mayor’s office and I brought my passport and I called the newspapers before, because this is the nature of the media that they are all so vain and they like good stories. So I knew that this would probably be irresistible for them to accompany me to the mayor’s office and see me turning in my passport. So that is what I did. This story actually became the most read story of the area of this newspaper. And then when I made such a statement on the front pages, the local authorities immediately had to come and make a counter statement the next day claiming that everyone living on Norwegian soil had to conform to Norwegian law and that it would be impossible actually to secede from the state. And then I made a counter reply also in the newspaper on the whole page saying that it wasn’t really relevant to me what the government’s response was because it was exactly their jurisdiction that I challenged and I didn’t believe in. [1:00:26]
HP: What paper was that, by the way, and how come they agreed to give you such space there?
IS: Exactly, because this was a local newspaper. It was the county newspaper called Telemark Arbeiderblad.
HP: Right
IS: The [more recent name is] Telemarksavisa. So when you go to the local level even if the story comes out in a small newspaper when the story has transcendence, it is immediately picked up by everyone so very quickly it had been shared many thousand times on Facebook and such. So even a small newspaper can be used as a channel to bring forth this information and had they known the criticism that they would get afterwards they would have thought twice most likely. But what I have come to understand is that the media is kind of a double-edged sword because you can also use it to your advantage because the media has an interest in publishing things that everyone would like to read. They are like prostitutes in that sense. [1:01:48]
HP: All for the numbers, yes.
IS: So if you can get their interest in some way, sometimes they will swallow the bait. And so they did. Then the role that I carved for myself was that of a guinea pig, which means that all of a sudden everybody knew what I had done, and all eyes were on me, which is what I wanted. Because to put yourself up against the government is actually dangerous, so I knew that I had to be in the middle of the bull’s eye because that is where you are most protected. For me, I was very curious to see how the government would react after that because what I did was very intimidating for them. So far there has just been one direct encounter and what happened there was what you actually saw and that is how you found me.
HP: Yes, the video when, who was filming that, by the way?
IS: That was a friend, and by the grace of the universe he was with me that day.
HP: Right.
IS: I was so lucky. The government has done various things to harass me, but none of them as directly as on this day. So what happened was that just to make a living I now do other things that I used to do before. So I give clairvoyant readings, I wash houses, and I do spring rolls for sale. So then one day someone called me from the regional mattensene [spelling? Did I hear this correctly?] it is called, which is the national food and drug authority, the FDA, and they told me that they heard that I was producing spring rolls. And the way that they knew was by means of anonymous informers because that is how it works.
HP: Someone was snitching on you, hunh?
IS: Snitching on me! Which was kind of cute because I am snitching on myself every day. [Laughter].
HP: Right, right.
IS: Which is what I do is actually to always publish very openly my intentions and the things I do so then someone snitched on them saying that, probably saying that she is producing spring rolls and she isn’t paying taxes. Maybe you should look into that.
HP: Oh God, yes.
IS: So they called me and they said we hear you are producing spring rolls. I said, “Yes I do, and they are very good also, would you like to order?” Then they told me, or I told them we need to continue this conversation by mail because it is very important always to have written record of the things that take place as a protection. So they mailed me and they said in a very kind way, “Well you know, we can help you actually to establish a more secure production and we can give you some good advice on how to produce these spring rolls.” Then I told them, “Oh, thank you, that was a very kind offer,” but I declined because I already know these things. “So thank you but no thank you.” And then they mailed me back a little more condescending this time saying that, “OK, then probably you also know it is your duty to register your enterprise.” Then I said, “OK, but actually your jurisdiction doesn’t apply to me because I am not any longer a part of the state.” So then they fell silent for some time, and one day I woke up early in the morning and then at my door were two ladies, smiling, saying “Hello, we are from the FDA, can we come to inspect your kitchen?”
HP: [Laughter]. That’s funny.
IS: I said, “Oh, no, sorry, you cannot. Bye, bye.”
HP: So it was all good vibes, no kind of anger in there?
IS: Yes
HP: It is funny, because, this is what I have been trying to describe to people as well, it is very much, it is a tyranny, but it comes in a velvet glove. It's helpful. "We are not here to hurt you. We just want to help you.” Unless you continue to resist what they want you to impose on you. Then you will feel a strong force after some time. But yes, do go on.
IS: Exactly, and just another point, as a sovereign, in the old days, and as a general rule, you always lost your legal standing if you were in dishonor or if you did not treat other people honorably. So to me it is kind of a point always to be honorable. To treat other people honorably. So I feel that very many in the public discourse, they are very angry with the government, so they become abusive. But we had a very nice conversation, and then I said “Chow, chow,” and after one week or so, they came back in the morning once again, then with a police man. Luckily I had a friend to stay, I had a friend visiting, so I went in to get him to ask him to film what went on. So we came to the door, and I said that “Hello, we will be filming this.” And the police officer said, “No, absolutely not.” I said “Oh yes.” And he said, “No, that is not going to happen.” My friend said, “You know, this is actually private territory, so what on grounds?” He was actually more strict so he said, “That’s not your choice, this is private property.”
HP: Right, yes.
IS: So the police officer quite visibly felt embarrassed and insecure.
HP: He tried to call you out, right, like step outside of your own property kind of thing so we can actually grab you.
IS: He came back to me and spoke in a very authoritarian, very deep voice. Saying, “OK, so step outside with me.” And my friend said, “And who are you?” And he felt his police [unintelligible]. And he said, “I am the local police.” So I just told him, “On what legal basis do you ask me to come with [you]?
HP: Well you are the known spring roll terrorist, haven’t you heard? Yes.
IS: [Laughter]. So actually he tried four times to call me out, and you know he was very insecure but he kind of took on the Dirty Harry attitude and tried to intimidate me with the use of authority in the traditional sense. I just kept standing, and they actually had to leave while we were filming all of it. Since then they have not come back. But on the next day the local newspaper came and also the local media and then we were all on television. They told me that, “Well, someone has apparently fallen ill from eating your spring rolls.”
HP: Oh God.
IS: Yes.
HP: Oh boy.
IS: You know, the authorities are actually known to fabricate evidence, and they do it all the time.
HP: Sure. Yes.
IS: So they also said on the television because the reporter asked what will you do next. Will you apply the use of force? They said, “Oh no, by no means, we just want dialog.” So when I was on TV the same night I actually told them that "You are very welcome to visit me in my home to enter into dialog with me. I will not enter it under your jurisdiction. So it is not about legal issues. In a friendly way we can come together and we can have a conversation." So then, I did not hear anything else, and yes, they mailed me saying, “No thank you, but we will call you to come to our office because we would like to inform you of your legal rights.” Then I just mailed them, saying, “Sorry, actually your jurisdiction doesn’t apply.”
HP: Right.
IS: So far that was the end of it.
HP: How long ago was that since we are speaking now here on the 10th of April, how long ago was this?
IS: Well the last conversation or the last contact we had was yesterday. Yes, so they sent me the evidence that they had got from the informer who claimed that someone had fallen ill. So they actually had two pieces of evidence and one of them didn’t carry a date. No names, nothing. Just a simple note saying that someone has fallen ill, probably over your spring rolls. And that was it. The other one had a date and was actually a genuine informer’s note. So it said that, 'Well, this person is producing spring rolls and not paying taxes, and this is the evidence.” Then they had screenshots of some of my comments from Facebook. Yes, so that is how far we got.
HP: Oh boy. Wow, so, yes, they are trying to obviously intimidate you to get you to bow down. So what is your next step is? Are you afraid of this, because obviously as we have seen in the past, you know, if it goes far enough, they don’t only knock on your door, they break down the door and just come and grab you. Are you afraid of that? [1:12:39]
IS: I am not afraid, actually, because in my case the decisions that I have taken in my life have come parallel with also a spiritual life or realizations on an inner level and I feel that I am protected, actually. I really am not afraid because I have been through so many processes to shred all of my belief systems and all minor blockings, so what I feel is actually trust and bliss and I feel very happy. What I irradiate to the people is calm and happiness and friendliness, I think. So that is a very potent weapon, actually. It is some kind of very silent revolution, very peaceful, very friendly revolution. There is no way that they can come track this because as long as I remain in honor with the words that I choose and with my actions, and as long as I am heard and visible, that is actually very hard to do something about. So it is kind of a standing that I have chosen for myself, consciously, and we are also doing some legal measures like establishing a people’s jury. The purpose of it is simply to put the government on the spot, asking them where they derive their authority from, because that is the one question they can not dare being asked this question because it is so compromising for them.
HP: I think it will be a self-referencing reference pretty much that go back to some kind of legal paragraph, or something like that, saying “This proves we have authority.” Well, you just wrote that on a piece of paper, so I can write that on a piece of paper and counteract you with the same authority. So it is kind of silly obviously when one really gets down to the nitty and gritty of the structure of this kind of level of authority, but one thing I wanted to ask you about, that is how did this, when you were attempting then to write yourself out of this system or the authority that they claimed they hold over you, how did that kind of language work in that regard? Was this something you studied before hand or was it very much kind of off the cuff just a simple kind of layman’s terms type of wording on this or did you use some legalese and that kind of stuff in it? [1:15:29]
IS: Well actually in terms of the preliminary process, I have for a long time been very discontent and feeling of course that something was wrong. I have been kind of afraid to open the mail box. Afraid to lag behind on some reports to be turned into the government. Some bills to be paid. And when I really woke up to how the world is put together, and the pieces started to fall into place, it just became more unbearable by the day to have any association whatsoever with the government because the government promotes cruelty to an enormous extent. We both know that.
HP: Yes.
IS: So I felt that I actively contributed to promoting this cruelty when I am a citizen, but it was really not until the government started applying pressure on me that I was kind of able to wake up and shake off this trance because I told you how they tried to put us down through the media in very vicious ways, actually. And what they do when you speak up, when you are a non-conformist is that they try to demonize you first, and if it doesn’t work, they try to break you economically. So that is what they did to me. What happened to me is that the pressure that they applied to me kind of made my inside burst and out came sovereign woman. So I was very discontent in not knowing exactly how to act and what to do. And then, I just woke up one morning and knew kind of within every cell of my body that I could not consent, not even for one more day, to being governed, and especially by such brute force. In our culture we have not been taught to kind of recognize the truth from the lie in a good way so we are not used to listening to the body and recognizing the signals. But when I took the position of becoming sovereign I could just feel that my whole body responded with joy and with happiness, as if shaking off a veil. The same thing actually happened to me that my body responded very loudly or clearly when I changed my name and lost the name that the government owns, my previous name. I took my father’s name.
HP: So you went back and took your Dad’s name?
IS: Yes, I chose it. I chose myself actually, which is not the legal person name.
HP: Right. OK
IS: So it is not the registered name in any way. So what I did then is I wrote to the King and to the government, just making statements that are a declaration of sovereignty, stating that I now consider myself a sovereign woman and I disassociate from any implied contract that has been forced on me by birth. You know I was very careful to chose my own wording but not using legalese terms really because legalese does not apply, not really. It is more about knowing who you are, and knowing that you as a living person can never be forced to enter into a jurisdiction forced on you by other human beings. So I stated that I was a living woman, living sovereign woman, not any more a legal, fictitious person, and gave my reasons for this. So far I have not received any response and I really don’t need also to receive any response. But I did contact the legal department on some occasions. What I experienced is that the government employees are helpless because they cannot possibly engage in this kind of conversation because it is beyond their scope. Also there isn’t any language, or what is it called, it is not terminology that they are even versed within.
HP: Right.
IS: So they don’t know what to say, so they just respond on autopilot actually, always giving automatized responses. [1:20:54]
HP: So what address did you use to send this? One you sent to Harald, right, the King then, and where did you send the other one?
IS: I sent it to the Department of Justice. I am also not the only one. A number of people have actually done the same thing as I have. What I see is that even if in the beginning people became actually kind of aggressive towards me and feeling threatened by my actions, now, new terminology has been introduced into the public discourse so many more people have awareness of this and they have begun to discuss statehood and the basis for the powers of the state, which is amazing. So it raised awareness, which actually was my purpose, has happened. But to me, what I actually felt on a spiritual level was that because I went to something called the Princess Martha Spiritual School. It is actually in Norwegian called the angel school. It is really just transmitting esoteric knowledge. And so--
HP: Let me ask you about that, sorry, was it princess Märtha Louise of Norway, is that the one?
IP: Yes, she is the one.
HP: So what is her -- I am not saying that she is on the same page as you are and what not -- but obviously there is a tie-in with the royalty there who has been representative of the very legal structure that we are basically talking about here. Today of course they fill quite a different role. I don’t know how the position exactly is politically or what kind of enforcement power King Harald has in Norway, but nonetheless there is a tie-in there. So did she, I don’t know if you spoke to her directly or anything, but if so is she aware of any of this?
IS: There is actually also a tie between us and I genuinely think that she is not aware of any of this or that she has not given it any concentration whatsoever. She was very brave in coming forth and promoting this school and this kind of knowledge because --
HP: Sorry to cut you off again, but just to clarify that she was kind of, it was a little more of a New Age kind of, in that environment a little bit, right? She had a psychic spiritualism and some kind of things like that, right, in her school?
IS: Just to clarify that I am not in any way on the New Age page whatsoever.
HP: Right.
IS: And I absolutely apply the spiritual principles and practice into my life which is why I am coming forth as a sovereign person or woman. But I have been one of the critics of the king’s role, actually, because it is always diminished to us. We are told that but he doesn’t have any formal powers.
HP: Right.
IS: He is actually, he has signature powers, which is the real power. That is how power is defined.
HP: Yes.
IS: So he is actually the culprit. He is the source of the cruelty, really. There is no other way of putting it. That is confusing to people because, and you know the anatomy of power is not so easy to understand always because all it takes is signing a piece of paper, and you can be conscious or unconscious of that. But that is the King’s role, actually.
HP: Right. Yes. He is the face of it, nonetheless, whether he knows it, or likes it, or whatnot, yes.
IS: Yes, exactly. So these are probably painful realizations, and I don’t think that they have come to grips with this aspect at all. But for me, what I realize is that sovereignty also has a spiritual aspect and that opening up your energies and your crown chakra depends on not having someone invading your energetic field. So what I felt very strongly was that what the government does is kind of hacking into your energetic field and preventing your crown chakra from functioning. When you see the sovereigns, they actually wear a gold crown. Both in a spiritual sense and in a practical sense, that bears meaning. So the significance of it is actually that we have an energy field open because they have no ties or no bonds to any other authority, any entity, trying to feed off their energy, actually.
HP: Yes. So let’s see here if there is anything else we need to discuss there in detail about that in terms of what the effects of this are, not only of course in terms of your own life you think, but also what the ramifications are with this. Do you sincerely believe that there is any kind of department within the government that actually can process anything of what you have actually sent to them, or is it just basically that they are trying to determine what they are to do with this in the mean time? Trying to figure it out in some way. I guess that is usually why they fall silent, right? This is something for them also. They can take years I guess to draw out the process, I guess, I don’t know.
IS: I think it all depends on us actually and our ability to go beyond the level of the government and realizing that we hold the actual powers.
HP: Sure. Yes.
IS: And the radical realization that we have actually the right to live without being ruled because we are always told that if we don’t have a ruler everything will just become chaos and deteriorate.
HP: Sure.
IS: And as I see it it is the exact opposite actually. So what governments do is that they bestow upon themselves the powers to commit crimes that none of us can do. So governments, they can instigate wars, promote destruction of the environment, and rob the population, and we as individual people would be so heavily punished for these crimes.
HP: Yes. That is right.
IS: As I see it, this is what government really is. And as I see it when we can sense through governments these destructive forces, we abandon our responsibility, which is a very comfortable thing to do. It is very easy to lean against the government and rely on them and feel that you are taken care of. But as I see it, that is not what we are doing on this earth.
HP: And that won’t last, either. Sorry to interrupt again but you might be comfortable for people for a while. It might be for, and I am not saying it has been for our generations now, necessarily, but the violence that they exuberate is definitely more cyclical, if I can put it that away, as opposed to physical, but nonetheless, it might be comfortable for a while, but we know that if human beings don’t stand up to the tyrannical system around them they will take more power, they will take more money, they will take more laws than what we had, and eventually if it is not us, it will be two or three generations down the line now that will have to fight the tyranny for us. So our comfort that we wanted is something that is going to get a reaction further down the line, if you know what I mean.
IS: Yes, exactly. But it also has to do with liability in a legal sense because if you seem isolated if you look to the legal world, there is a book called The Heuristic Person by an author called George S. Sticer [sp?]. And he actually states very clearly that we are just as much an accomplice to the crimes committed by the corporation which is the government. It is our fault. We are just as much guilty as the government is of the crimes and the brutality carried outside the government. So what we tend to do is to kind of alienate the blame from ourselves. We think that hasn’t got anything to do with us at all. It actually does. When you are a legal person, as we all are, then we are actually responsible for the things the corporation does. When you are a natural man or woman, you are just as guilty of the crimes that you commit yourself. So this actually runs very deep. It carries an existential meaning also. This all raises very important questions. And we can’t avoid them for long because the moment has come to address them.
HP: Yes.
IS: What we see is that this is also a global tendency. So the work of heroes in many countries is rubbing off on me and other people like me in Norway and in other Scandinavian countries.
HP: Yes, exactly. People agree to it since they continue to fund it. That is the most fundamental basic level to it that the whole apparatus in itself of government --of course as we know most cities, I don’t know about municipalities necessarily, but cities are obviously incorporated. Even the very notion, the whole notion of being a corporation is an idea that has been dreamt up by the government. It is a legal framework that they have put into place, you know. But nonetheless that means to a certain extent that they might be primarily seeking profit as opposed to working as an advantage to the people who fund it, but nonetheless if people continue to fund it, then it will maintain, and the fact is that since it doesn’t generate any money on its own, but just does it as a parasitical entity which takes from everyone else and then distributes accordingly to what it thinks is good and also on top of it they take a lot of that money and it goes into the wrong coffers. There is corruption on top of that so it ends up in the pockets of people who are within politics. That is really where people need to start standing up to it. I think there is nowhere in the world as that particular aspect that is that difficult than it is in Scandinavia when it comes to that particular aspect about money and taxes and just the immense power that the state has in these countries.
IS: Yes, that is right. I also feel that it is a mental short cut to understand that we are the actual chattel of the government. That they are trading up, actually, completely, and our governments are all of them registered on the Washington, D.C. recorder of deeds so they are registered corporations. The Kingdom of Sweden is easily found. [1:33:19]
HP: Yes, I found it. I saw it.
IS: Yes, you are right. So the purpose of this, it is as if registration is kind of the way of trapping us. When we are entered into registration we also become practically the property of someone. This is also why we had to be registered as persons or legal persons. Then the government actually holds the security interest over us and can kind of operate under merchant law which has nothing to do with what we think is the Norwegian law. So the way that they have been trading our birth certificates and our biomat [sp? Did she mean bio data?], everything that can be traded is a point that goes home to a lot of people.
HP: Yes, absolutely. Now I don’t want to shift focus too much, if there is more of course that you want to say about this too, but there are a couple of other aspects that we could discuss. It has to do for example with how there has been a lot of people forcefully admitted into mental hospitals in not only in Norway, but in Sweden too. There has been a long history of eugenics programs running a lot of experiments. I think some of the first experiments on the electronic versions of mind control and implantable chips to affect the brain and whatnot was actually done in Sweden for the longest time. You have aspects like the lebensborn, for example. The children of German soldiers and Norwegian mothers in Norway has been one of the most suppressed groups ever. They were experimented on with LSD. They were raped, et cetera. This horrible history that they have been trying to cover up, so things are not as nice and dandy of course. Again, to go back to that initial point we talked about more in the first hour of that external façade that people only see, you know.
IS: That is a very good point actually because when we are told that this is the best country in the world, we are each told that in different ways in the Scandinavian countries, and the numbers give away the reality. So then statistics can be used and actually be useful tools of understanding because we see in Norway that as much as 10,000 people are being admitted into psychiatric wards forcefully every year which is enormously much in the land or in the country of the most happy people. We also see how many children are admitted into state care. 52,000 every year. These are horrendous numbers for such a small country. Pieces of our story that hasn’t been told to us keep coming up and it seems that it can’t be covered any longer really because it surfaces somehow. So stories of mass graves outside the psychiatric hospitals where they have been doing experiments on the ethnic groups or the original Lapp people in Norway has come to the surface. As you say, enrolling them into experiments with LSD and lobotomy and sterilizing all of them up until 1976 actually. So this is quite recent history.
HP: Let me say something about that too, because I think this is an interesting aspect. I usually bring this up when it comes to the specific targeting and also persecution of certain peoples because we seem to neglect the historical aspects since we are talking about Norway overall, how it gained the authority that it did. It didn’t happen overnight. It was not something which was agreed upon by all the rest of the people in the country. So for example when we see a situation like this you might think “Oh my God, everyone in Norway and/or Sweden are ganging up on the Samis altogether!” Right? The idea there is that I think the Samis are one of the tribes that still manage to live on and that is either due to their basic northward location all the way up in Lapland or it might be possibly because of later entry into Scandinavia from the more northern tip of Asia, but nonetheless if you look at for example at all the landscapes in Sweden and Norway, most of the place names come from the fact that there used to be really powerful tribes, or there was a king that lived there that had the people there. For example in Norway you had the Raumarici which comes from the Romerike, further down in Bohuslän you had the Vinoviloth [Ed. Note: This is the closest that I could find in a list of ancient tribal names to what I think he said]. I am butchering some of the names here, but they come from a guy called Jordanes who wrote about the history of the Skandza or Skandinavia [using Latinized names]. And you have like the Suetidi, the Goths, of course, the Heruli, the Granii, the Augandzi, the Eunixi, it goes on and on. The Arochi, the Raumi from Romsdal, is like all of these tribes have been under the conquest as the Norwegian government has been formed throughout history and centralized, these tribes, if they have not been exterminated, they have been absorbed into the bigger governmental system. All these tribes have been targeted. They have been removed from their own culture and heritage and today what we see in these countries is very much a boiled down version of the culture that used to be there, you know what I mean? So it is like we can be kind of myopic sometimes when we see it. It means that everyone who has been living in these countries has been subjected to the same level of tyranny that we can see against someone like the Sami for example, it is just this is later in the process. Now of course what is worse in the picture for the Sami is that they have a greater scientific and technological apparatus at their disposal so their experiments and whatnot becomes even more ruthless and brutal. So that is my five cents on that issue. [1:39:54]
IS: That is very interesting actually because most people don’t question for a second the state’s claim to territory. They do support the state’s claim that they own the Norwegian land and that this is theirs to govern as they like. Theirs to exploit the way they like, and as I see it, which is obviously also the truth, is just that someone came along and made a claim just like they did in Australia or in all of the world, actually, saying that, “This is mine, now my rules apply.” And then time passes and it becomes cemented in the minds of the people. But when you mention our history and our spiritual traditions which are very strong up in the North, and the original tribes and the Viking tradition actually, and how they fought to expel the Romans --
HP: Yes
IS: That is a very beautiful part of our history and we aren’t told that so often.
HP: How is that in Norwegian schools, by the way. Are you allowed to talk about this or does that encourage the history? I know that there is a couple of, like the Østfold ship for example in Norway, very famous, a beautiful old Viking ship and whatnot, in Sweden I remember growing up we heard more about Napoleon and the Roman Empire and all these other countries, what happened there, as opposed to our own history and our own, I mean the cultural, the way we have been culturally severed in I would say Scandinavia, but I can only speak in this regard for Sweden, have been tremendous. The way it has been associated with all kinds of nonsense like racism and everything else, where I think it has been very efficient for them to cut us from that. I mean the Viking strain has a natural rebellious tendency to it to that extent. I mean, for example, we mentioned this earlier, the concept of the Thing was one of the oldest, not democratic versions, because democracy is still kind of representative as it came out of Greece, but free men and women in pre-Viking and post-Viking Scandinavia, they could speak for themselves. They could gather at these sites where they had stone circles and talk and speak for themselves and cast a vote for an issue that was to occur. The tradition there for that type of government is quite unique on a historical basis. Actually people don’t know about that, but, you know?
IS: Yes, what you see in school is actually is a very powerful dumbing down of us, all of us. I feel in my own case how much I have had to struggle to make my way through all of the belief systems imposed upon me. And we are taught history in very fragmented ways, as events with days that we are supposed to repeat in various ways and we cannot connect the dots, not at all, so we are never taught how to connect the dots and how to see the deeper truths. So that is something that has come as an adult actually and many of us are now spending so much time trying to connect these dots. Trying to make sense of missing pieces of our history that we have never been told and the force with which the Vikings actually met the Romans, is something that should have a tremendous bearing. It is a very important point in our history, actually. But what I believe is that the Roman tradition, or the Vatican now these days holds the actual power through the Jesuits and through the Masonic lodges in our countries, which is why we never learn or we never hear about these things because the Romans have come back in more occult ways.
HP: Yes, I mean that legal framework of Papal Bulls and everything else, something people forget, of many thousands of years we go back as we try to claim the whole world, but one of the battles that people can read about is the Battle of the Teutoberg Forest. That is basically in northern Germany where a lot of Germanic tribes gathered because they realized the threat of the Roman Empire, and they managed to hold them back. It was a huge defeat [suffered] by the Romans. After that point they actually realized that they were trying to, OK, if you can’t beat them, let’s try to join them. They actually entered into an interesting relationship after that. They never dared to come up here and try to claim it. That never happened. You had a period where you had more freedom of culture as well in the northern countries for a longer period than they did in the rest of Europe outside of that Roman framework. Nonetheless, I think it is real interesting story that actually brings up a different kind of flavor to it, but the Romans had definitely been an advantage in them. Later on when Christianity came in, as well, that was also seen as an invader. We talked about this with Steven McNallen, by the way, in terms of the Viking Age and all that. The raids that you see was most likely, the one and only reason for those and the violent raids, was because of a response and a reaction to the incoming and threatening to the people, the Christianization of the northern lands, you know?
IS: And for me I have just recently actually been diving a little into the mythology and beliefs of the Vikings because we have never been taught this in school.
HP: Exactly.
IS: I was also surprised to see the transcendence of the teachings or the beliefs and the depth of the spirituality of the things that they believed in. I really had no idea at all. So it is as if our understanding has been so brutalized throughout recent history that these notions that were so advanced and run so deep within our psyche, these are not familiar to us at all because we are taught basically very superficial stuff in school so we can only recognize reality on kind of a very superficial level.
HP: It needs to be rediscovered by the people in Northern Europe, no doubt about it. It needs to be revived again. I mean it is all there. People, they run to Hinduism or Buddhism or they run to some kind of New Age theology and whatnot, but it is like you have a tradition right there which is beautiful, it is connected to yourself, to your own people through your blood, you know. It is like a huge shame that they managed to do this, but again we talked about this before, before we began the second hour Ingunn, I think it has to do with the fact that there is a spirit of rebellion within that tradition that is very, very --the mechanism of control, rather, whoever the people are who are trying to force that mechanism at whatever given time in history know that this is something that cannot be awakened or associated in any way. Again, therefore, do not teach it in school. Tell them they were all barbarians, and it ends there, we are just violent and brutal people, that is it, as opposed to really giving them the full story and the real mythology and the real tremendous, I wouldn't say religious, but spiritual tradition that resides within the mythology itself. So I think that is one of the reasons why they did such a tremendous experiment on the Northern countries as well, Ingunn. The way they wanted to create this kind of political laboratory, try to subjugate the people under control, because it was one of the small countries, small populations, it is simple of course, it is more easily applicable but it is also for a much, much deeper reason, I believe, because they did not want any of this outbreak of this type of energy, if you will, to burst on to the world scene again because that would be detrimental to them, you know?
IS: That is a very good point, and I never thought about that, but we have as a matter of fact become so subdued and it would be wonderful if we would have access to this force again. As it seems to me, we are aided on all levels, also spiritual levels in bringing forth what might be termed revolution, but what this revolution is, is rather changing the focus from the state and back to the people and back to the grass roots and to where the real loyalty lies because we are always told that our loyalty should be with the state, and if we are not loyally paying taxes, for instance, we are also letting down communities. We must be ruled, because without being ruled, we are barbarians. That is the slogan. That is the mantra, and they repeat it all the time.
HP: [Laughter] Yep.
IS: So I can see that there is a growing grass roots consciousness. A feeling that the real brotherhood is our force and that is where we derive strength from. That is where the beauty lies, and that is where the focus goes. This might be the way of reducing the state’s power because the state has reached a point where it is imploding upon itself because it has applied so much force, brute force, towards the people, the normal people, on the grass roots level. And then up comes flowering, a new consciousness that actually makes us remember that we are brothers and sisters and co-creators so somehow we might be reverting to something we have lost, something we have had before, but it seems to be springing forth very naturally.
HP: I don’t think it something that can be held back, and it has been for a few thousand years. What people forget too, though, is that we are talking about traditions that have existed for, I mean, if not tens of thousands of years, thousands of years, and this is prior to the subjugation of the Roman system, which was a measure of control, and with that came the state religion of Christianity and a lot of these traditions were branded as pagan and heathen and evil and brutal and barbaric and all the rest. We know the story now. But the fact is that if this is a tradition which is tied to the lands and tied to the people, this something that exists within there. This is not something that is going to go away. I mean even if one believes in genetic memory or what not it is still something that is tied into the cultural psyche, if you will. You can’t just eradicate that and expect it to go away forever. It is kind of like how other cultures are about their traditions and their gods. The Greek gods, or you know however you want to view that. And the fact too, I want to mention, is that there are people who think “Oh, well, we don’t know anything about that," or whatnot. There are hundreds of texts and stories from this time. There has been so much written consequently as well by so many scholars and researchers that have taken what has been available in these stories and traditions that have been passed down primarily through the Icelandic scholars. The skalds, those who were the bards, singing about this and writing about it too. But you know the gods of the Viking age, in Northern myths, there are hundreds of excellent books written about the subject. If people want to find out, that is all I am saying, it is there. It is just that we do not know it is there, you know?
IS: It also seems to be part of our cell memory or deeply embedded in our psyches because I really had not given it so much thought but I have seen that lately very many Viking societies get organized, and honoring the Viking tradition so much more. So this is actually being brought to light again by many people.
HP: Beautiful. Well I think that is a really positive note to all of this as well. Yes, I do hope that we can see something like that. It needs to be done, because again, for people who don’t live in the Northern countries and don’t understand the true nature of the silent tyranny that exists there, the quiet, subdued kind of imprisonment, if you will, very much on the psychic level primarily. It is difficult to convey that and it is difficult to explain really the nature there, but it is there, it does exists, and the fact is this something needs to occur there before things go too far and too out of hand. Otherwise we are looking at a population completely under the control and subjugation of the state. It feels like it could go a little bit either way there, Ingunn. Is there anything else you would like to round things up on here before we begin to wrap up for this time, Ingunn? Something you want to leave us with? Something else? Obviously we want to hear about your web sites again, where people can go to follow your writing. I know it is primarily in Norwegian at this moment, but nonetheless, it is there, and you have it, so please tell us about it.
IS: The name of the web site is Sigurdsdatter.com. And as we speak that is being translated into English also. You soon will be very welcome to come visit my web site. I am so happy to come on to this program because it is part of uniting us and tying us into a web of brothers and sisters around the world, connecting on a different note than before. So I’m very grateful for the invitation to come on to the program and if anyone wishes to contact me, they are very welcome to do so. So you will find my email and my contact info on my web site.
HP: Very, very good. Thank you Ingunn. Stay brave of course, and please keep us posted again. We would love to talk more with you and see how the developments go and just stand your ground and find that spot within yourself and call upon the greater force, if you will, and I don’t think they will stand a chance. [1:55:36]