is still a work-in-progress subject to review and correction
by the various principles involved that may be reasonably but
not totally accurate at this stage for research purposes.
Real Deal Radio Show
Dr. James Fetzer Ph.D.
Guests: Leuren Moret and Christina Consolo
Real Deal download page here,
MP3 download here
(51.4 MB, 2:30:00).
Part I: Published at Veterans Today
Part II: Published at Veterans Today here
Editor’s Note: This transcription
was prepared with "Editor's Notes" by William B. Fox,
Publisher, America First Books, who also helped organize this
interview. He has supplied the additional text that appears
in brackets below..
1 of 2
This is Jim Fetzer your host on The Real Deal, continuing
research on Fukushima. I have two experts with me today, I am
very pleased to say. One is Christina Consolo, also known as
"RadChick." Also Leuren Moret from San Francisco,
Oakland Bay area who is an independent geoscientist. Both of
them have done extensive work on Fukushima. Christina, let me
begin with you. You have had a radio show called "Nuked
Radio" and you have a web site FukushimaFacts.com,
how did you get drawn into research on this catastrophe?
Christina Consolo: Well I noticed early on
after the reactors exploded we already had symptoms of possible
fallout in my area of the country in southeast Michigan. I had
the metallic taste. I noticed a few weeks after that a lot of
the pine trees started turning red, and later on that summer
I even noticed mutations in some of the plants and young trees
that were growing around here. That is when I really started
looking into atmospheric transport and seeing whatever I could
find about past nuclear accidents to try to figure out what
was happening with this one because there was just no news about
it at all.
Dr. Fetzer: Had you done any research in this
area? I mean was that anything you had ever studied in school
Christina: Well, Chernobyl happened when I
was a senior in high school and we spent quite a bit of time
studying it back then and I was intrigued by it. And then I
have friends and family who worked in the nuclear industry.
So it has always been kind of part of my life, and I also was
a big supporter of it for a while before I really knew the truth
of how dangerous these plants were.
Dr. Fetzer: Well it looks to me like you have
done quite a lot of research on it. Leuren, I know you have
been noticing some signs of contamination along the Pacific
coast and even in Berkeley and San Francisco. Can you tell us
some of those indications that things are not going well?
L. Moret: Well, I really noticed it at Christmas,
this past Christmas of 2012 when I was traveling on public transportation
and also walking up and down the sidewalks, seeing people you
don't normally see and babies that don't normally come out into
the public view. What I noticed, which was really alarming,
is that I saw many indications of birth defects in babies that
were born just before or since the Fukushima disaster on March
11, 2011. I knew right away because I was seeing Down Syndrome
babies and toddlers, babies with eye defects, birth defects.
The brain and the eyes develop in the first month when an
embryo is exposed in that stage very often the brain and/or
the eyes are damaged. I also noticed a toddler who had been
born in the month, sometime in late February before Fukushima
happened. She was about almost two years old, riding on a bus.
I moved around from the seat I was in to be able to face her
and her baby sitter and I looked at this baby, and the woman
who was taking care of her, an older African American woman,
noticed that and she said this baby is a dwarf. I love her,
but she will never be taller than she is now. I said, "How
old is she? When was she born?" She said, "Late
February 2011." So then I knew that radioactive iodine
had affected the endocrine system, which is the pituitary, thyroid,
and what is the one? Adrenal glands which control growth, organ
function, everything in the body. I realized that it had to
be Fukushima radioactive iodine that had damaged her. So that
was particularly important to see these birth defects expressed
already a year and a half after Fukushima because the babies
and the unborn are the most susceptible to damage by the ionizing
radiation. What Dr. [L. J.] LeVann said, he did a study on bomb
testing in Alberta, Canada and other parts of Canada, but he
was writing about the effects and researching the effects of
the very large hydrogen bomb tests that the Soviets did in the
reported in this landmark paper that damage to a developing
organism, an organism in the developmental stages has ten to
a 100 million times greater damaging effects on that organism
than after they are born or they are in later stages of their
lives. So the litmus test for ionizing radiation of course is
the unborn and the babies, and what we are seeing are increases
in infant mortality across the U.S. as well as around the world.
Decreases in fertility, and then very strange things like I
have seen two cases in the last week of men reported with breast
cancer. One man who lived in Massachusetts, who was in his early
40's and an athlete, had breast cancer twice in both of his
breasts. So these are just some of the indications. The environment
is also contaminated. There have been reports about radiation
levels in dried sea weed or they call it nori
in Japan in the Chiba area which is between Tokyo and Fukushima
and also in seaweed off of the West Coast. We will talk in more
detail during the interview [about this] but we wanted to give
you first an update on the Fukushima typhoons, this would be
from Oct 15th to the present and then compare that to 28 signs
we have now that the West Coast is absolutely getting fried.
The West Coast of the Pacific Coastline of North America. We
will just talk about biological effects and the effects on infants,
also the environmental effects, and then we would like to cover
this very alarming increase in nuclear power, who is getting
involved now. It is China taking over the British system. Also
the fact that Janet Napolitano who is head of Home Land Security
has now been hired as President of the University of California
which is the biggest weapon of mass destruction producer in
the world, and that seems to be on the increase. No doubt they
will be using many nuclear weapons on civilian populations not
only in Iraq and Afghanistan, Lebanon, Gaza, but they are going
to be using them in the developed super power countries as well.
Dr. Fetzer: Christina, before we go further,
the latest results [voice echoes in background] and we are getting
a lot of feedback, I don't know why, but you have noticed some
signs in Michigan already of radioactive contamination. Could
you mention a word or two about those?
Christina:: Oh, absolutely. The first summer
in 2011 I had been a gardener, an avid gardener, and grown my
own produce for 17 years and I was always interested in mutations
because that was my area of expertise was actually in genetics
and retinal pathology in clinical research, but I never saw
anything in nature. Pretty soon I started seeing it happening.
Things that grew very fast, things that uptake a lot of water
like dandelions and weeds and young trees and things of that
nature. And then when I went back to the Chernobyl research
I learned about the findings in tree leaves and flowers and
then later in animals, I started a page on Facebook called Mutation
Watch and I put out a call for images to see what
people were noticing in their part of the country. You know
I get emails every day saying I have been growing corn for 30
years and I have never seen anything like this, or I had these
trees on my property my whole life and they have never developed
triple and quadruple seedlings. Just all of these changes that
are occurring are the same exact same thing that happened after
Chernobyl and the same thing that happened after Three Mile
Island. I made the acquaintance of a woman named Mary
Osborn [Ouassiai] who is known as the mutation lady of Three
Mile Island. Whenever anyone in that area notices something
funny growing in their yard they call her and she comes over
and takes a picture of it and she has collected
thousands of images over the years, and when you put our
images next to each other, it is all the same thing. So in order
for this correlation to be incontrovertible we need to test
these plants, but there is no way to test them because the universities
are not going to let you just walk in and use their very expensive
equipment. Even to test just one small section of a plant would
take hours to do, so we are kind of stuck with just collecting
images for right now, making those images available to researchers
who want to use them in any of the research that they are doing
and just to keep asking the public for data and sourcing as
much of that as we can through social media. In turn, getting
the word out with social media as much as possible too since
all of these agencies and organizations that have been set up
to protect us and warn us about fallout or other contaminants
are not really doing their job. At least from the evidence that
we are seeing.
Dr. Fetzer: Well it is stunning, and the fact
that these effects are being experienced clear across the country,
I mean from San Francisco, Oakland Bay to Michigan is really
stunning all by itself. Look Leuren, I know this new study includes
a map showing where the contamination is the greatest in the
West. The area of greatest concentration appears to be Chicago.
And I wonder what that means? Have you got an interpretation
about why Chicago or that area should be heavy among the many
areas in the country that are being so strongly affected?
L. Moret: OK, you are referring to the contamination
map from the article "28
Signs That the West Coast is Being [Absolutely] Fried..."?
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
L. Moret: OK, first of all, that is a map of
combined radiation contamination from different sources, so
part of it is the radiation released that has been released
every day from nuclear power plants across the U.S. So that
is why there are more symbols on the eastern half of the U.S.
Many of those are nuclear power plants which have been in operation
since the '60's and 70's. But also there is contamination from
the military sources, depleted uranium and so forth on military
bases and firing ranges and bombing ranges in the U.S. which
are, that stuff is all over the U.S. Every base is contaminated
with it, I think you could say. And of course then the rain
out and fallout, it is the rainout of the military munitions
radiological [effects] and mininukes that they have been using
in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, not Syria, Lebanon and other places
[Ed. Note: Actually there is strong evidence she had it right
the first time, namely that the U.S.-Israel axis has used mininukes
in Syria]. That comes across the ocean, believe it or not, all
the way across the Eurasian continent over the Pacific and then
it is rained out across the United States and Canada. So that
is part of the cause of elevated radiation in the U.S. Then
of course Fukushima is on top of that and I think that a lot
of the radiation, particularly in the western states and the
western slope of the Rocky Mountains -- a lot of that is Fukushima.
The very large alarming increase in death rates in the U.S.,
the highest increase is on the west slope of the Rocky Mountains
where rain and snow rains out the radiation transported in air
masses from west to east.
Dr. Fetzer: Christina, do you have that map
in front of you as we speak, because
I want to get your take too on what the distribution shows and
whether anything strikes you as especially interesting about
Christina: I don't have that map. I saw that
map, I don't have it right in front of me but I do know from
watching the atmospheric transport and I was doing a fallout
forecast for the first year after the accident trying to predict
where this rainout would occur and then seeing how it corresponded
to these various geiger networks that had been set up. We were
able to predict in about 90-95% of the time where the highest
levels would occur. And something that I see that happened on
a daily basis was higher levels around the Great Lakes region.
Part of that is because of all of the humidity from the Great
Lakes binds with these particles and they occur with rainout
and so forth. In Michigan we have a lot of variance in the weather
and in precipitation levels. As it is, being on the east coast
of [the state of Michigan adjacent to] Lake Huron, I know that
they get about four times the amount of precipitation on the
west coast of [Canada bordering Lake] Ontario which is across
the lake. So we have this lake effect that occurs, and we also
see that with snow fall totals in the Grand Rapids regions which
is on the western side of the state that anywhere around these
lakes is going to have a greater potential for fallout because
of the amount of humidity and increased precipitation. Most
of the time it is entirely dependent on where the rain falls
and where the snow occurs.
L. Moret: And then the Great Lakes watershed
is a vast and enormous region with rain out and snow out of
all this radiation flowing into the Great Lakes and increasing
the levels there. Of course the water evaporates, it washes
up on the shorelines. The radioactive particles are lofted into
the air and we know that the highest cancer rates in studies
from England and in the U.S. are along shorelines of lakes,
coastlines of geographic areas and river banks.
Signs That The West Coast Is Being Absolutely Fried With Nuclear
Radiation From Fukushima" by Michael Snyder,
on October 21st, 2013 "The map above comes from the
Nuclear Emergency Tracking Center. It shows that
radiation levels at radiation monitoring stations all over the
country are elevated. As you will notice, this is particularly
true along the west coast of the United States. Every single
day, 300 tons of radioactive water from Fukushima enters the
Pacific Ocean. That means that the total amount of radioactive
material released from Fukushima is constantly increasing, and
it is steadily building up in our food chain. Ultimately, all
of this nuclear radiation will outlive all of us by a very wide
margin. They are saying that it could take up to 40 years to
clean up the Fukushima disaster, and meanwhile countless innocent
people will develop cancer and other health problems as a result
of exposure to high levels of nuclear radiation. We are talking
about a nuclear disaster that is absolutely unprecedented, and
it is constantly getting worse. The following are 28 signs that
the west coast of North America is being absolutely fried with
nuclear radiation from Fukushima…"
Dr. Fetzer: Let me just encourage everyone
to pull up the article "28
Signs the West Coast is Being Absolutely Fried With Nuclear
Radiation From Fukushima" [by Michael Snyder]
since we are going to be discussing just as we are now not only
the map but also the 28 signs where I am very keen on getting
Leuren and Christina's explanations as about why those are so
significant. But Leuren, looking at the map, it seems to me
some of the heaviest contamination seems to be at locations
like, if I am not mistaken, Portland, Oregon, San Francisco,
possibly it is Los Angeles, more inland it looks like Albuquerque,
it looks like Denver, I don't know if that is Austin, Texas.
Then there is a real high contamination around what appears
to be Orlando. Am I right about those locations?
L. Moret: Those are all either locations where
either nuclear power plants, nuclear labs are located and I
have collected baby teeth and done studies with the radiation
and public health project around those regions in the Seattle
[area], the Northwest area including Portland. The Hanford Nuclear
Weapons Lab, which has produced plutonium for decades, has really
contaminated the Columbia River with constant releases of radiation
[so] that the fish populations are affected. The salmon in the
Columbia River have increasing female populations and decreasing
male populations which is happening globally in the human population
due to the hormonal and other effects of ionizing radiation
on glands. So we have much more intersex
now. That is where male and female reproductive cells are mixed
in the same organism. That shouldn't be happening. So polar
bears in the Arctic where the Soviets did nuclear bomb tests,
the females look normal and they have cubs with them, but they
also have vestigial penises as well as female reproductive organs.
There has been a study done at Svalbard
in the region of the nuclear bomb tests by the Soviet Union.
But it is happening in the human population and intersex is
being reported all over the world in humans.
Dr. Fetzer: Are you already to the first of
the 28 points?
L. Moret: Oh, I was just --
Dr. Fetzer: Just asking there--
L. Moret: I did not actually look at that,
but now we know that polar bears in the Arctic region and seals
and walruses also have reported fur loss. They are losing their
hair, their fur. They have open sores. The same thing is being
reported in the moose population along the Canadian-U.S. border
from the Pacific to the Atlantic. So this is radiation damage.
Radiation exposure causes these things and it is also happening
to flight crews for Alaska Airlines, to pilots flying through
the contaminated air column. The whole sky, the atmosphere is
contaminated all the way up into orbital space with this Fukushima
[radiation]. Very dynamic, very mobile plumes and nanoparticles
that are just spread all over the world. By 2020 the entire
Pacific Ocean will be contaminated by Fukushima radiation.
Dr. Fetzer: It is just dumbfounding. What do
you make of these sexual aberrations? Is that because sex chromosomes
are particularly sensitive to radiation? Is it just one more
manifestation on the order of the birth defects that you are
observing showing up with greater frequency in public places?
I mean it is all very profoundly disturbing.
L. Moret: Well it is because ionizing radiation,
and particularly depleted uranium or uranium is a hormone and
an estrogen disrupter. There was a very good study done at the
University of New Mexico, very, very good study, and they exposed
pregnant female mice to drinking water contaminated with depleted
uranium, but at levels the government says are safe. It caused
birth defects. It caused changes in abnormalities in the uterus,
the lining of the uterus, and of course that is the main cause
of endometriosis in women. It has grown, increased horrendously
since bomb-testing, particularly around nuclear facilities.
So when you change the messenger molecules in the reproductive
system all kinds of strange things happen. This isn't normal.
It shouldn't be happening, and men shouldn't have female reproductive
cells in them, and women shouldn't have male reproductive cells
in them. This is all new, and it is part of the miracle "ha-ha"
of the nuclear age. It is a nightmare.
Dr. Fetzer: Christine, are you detecting or
are there any indications of similar serious sexual abnormalities
in Michigan or other areas with which you are acquainted?
Christina: Not that I have had time to look
into. Of course it is difficult to find this information because
it is not shared freely by the public health departments. But
once you understand the way fallout affects populations from
studies that have been done, there were some very good studies
that were done in the UK in the 60's about childhood leukemia
that was very large in populations where women had x-rays done
during pregnancy and they found that the earlier in the pregnancy
that the pelvic x-ray was performed the greater likelihood of
that baby just from one x-ray, that baby had a 50% increase
in its chance of developing leukemia, kidney cancer, or brain
cancer. The number actually got higher the more x-ray exposure
that infant might have had. The study that was done, they tried
to correlate this with fallout, and each bomb test that was
done during peace time exposed people to approximately one x-ray,
or the amount of radiation from one x-ray. But we know that
just at that low level that it can be extremely damaging from
studies that were done back in the 60's. One in particular I
am thinking of from the University of Michigan that correlated
the effect of radioactive iodine in infants compared to adults
and it was as Leuren had said ten to a thousand times higher
for infants than adults. The exposure is greater for inhalation
vs. external exposure too, so now we have this ongoing fallout
that is coming out in our rains and getting in our food supply.
You might only be getting a little bit here and a little bit
there, but this is cumulative. This is going to be going on
the rest of our lives and our children's lives because there
is no way to shut off what is going on at that plant.
L. Moret: Jim--
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, Leuren, yes
L. Moret: Go ahead. I have something to say
when Christina finishes.
Christina: We have no way to clean up the three
melted fuel cores that are in the ground and this endless pouring
of water. What this plant has turned into is just a radiological
generating machine and there is no way to turn it off.
Dr. Fetzer: This is just stunning. I am just
blown away that Japan would go the direction of nuclear energy
when it had suffered the nuclear bomb attacks at Hiroshima and
Nagasaki. I mean, you would have thought there would be a tremendous
cultural revulsion against even doing that and yet they appear
to have been sold a package of how beneficial it would be. Even
Einstein said that he thought splitting the atom was a ridiculous
way to heat a cup of coffee. I mean, to boil water. I really
do think that the nuclear energy industry has abdicated its
responsibility, and of course we all know about the terrible
problem of nuclear waste which has never been resolved, and
where Leuren you may have mentioned recently how the situation
in Washington is catastrophic because there seems to be all
of this nuclear waste that is heading towards an aquifer. It
may have been Majia Nadesan in an interview we did just this
past week whom I was discussing [this with]. But all of this
is terribly disturbing.
L. Moret: Yes, well what I wanted to mention,
to add to what Christina presented on these special effects
of ionizing radiation, is that in September of 2007 the United
States Geological Survey, the U.S.G.S., published a paper, peer-reviewed,
and it was a fish study across the entire United States on intersex
in fish populations. And what they did was they sampled rivers
all over the U.S. and they took the male fish and investigated
the reproductive tissues to see how many of the fish, what percentage
in each particular population sample expressed intersex, and
that is where the male and female reproductive cells are mixed
in the same organism. What they reported was every sample --
every sample that they collected in the United States
had levels of intersex in the male fish population ranging from
low levels up to 95% of the males in the sample. Across the
entire U.S., there was only one river where the male fish did
not express intersex at some level and that was the Yukon River
Dr. Fetzer: Christina, do you think that there
is a political dimension to this that the government feels that
there is nothing the government can do so it is not going to
warn the population because it might generate hysteria? I mean
is that the sort of reasoning that might be taking place at
the highest levels? Because our government has to be aware of
the scientific facts that Leuren is relating here. They are
simply are not sharing them with the public.
Christina: Oh sure, I mean what has been suggested
to me during bomb testing is that they knew what the explosions
would do. What they wanted to find out is what it would do to
the downwind populations. If you read books like Secret
Fallout by Dr. Ernest Sternglass, he talks
about how people in the areas where they were conducting nuclear
weapons tests, the government would give the people free car
washes and they would measure the cars for contamination before
the wash and afterward, because they wanted to see how successful
decontamination would be. You know, we are being experimented
on. The only thing that is being controlled about this accident
is us. Our government is well aware of the research. Back since
the 1920's we have known that even low levels of radiation greatly
disrupts DNA. They have continued to introduce this into our
environment whether it is to make a sick population that then
the health care industry will be able to generate more revenue
from, or if it is control reasons. I don't know as much about
that as Leuren does from the historical or political perspective.
Dr. Fetzer: But it is just so obvious that
you are right, that we are being used as experimental subjects
but without our consent, so this is a gross violation of the
ethics for experimentation with human subjects which the government,
of course its own agencies are supposed to be upholding but
in fact the government itself is grossly violating.
L. Moret: Well 85% of the key positions in
the U.S. Government are held by Skull and Bones men from Yale.
Skull and Bones leads us directly to the London financiers and
the Anglo-American permanent war crimes racketeering syndicate
Dr. Fetzer: So you are suggesting that Yale
and Skull and Bones are really a conduit for producing intel
operatives and corrupt officials for the American government
to maintain its course in relation with DHS, Homeland Security,
the CIA and so forth.
L. Moret: I think that there is plenty of evidence
that has been out in the public venue that supports that. But
I would like to go back to the bomb-testing effects. Now Christina
said of course the government knew, and I would just like to
provide some evidence that supports what she is saying. In the
later 2000's I was testifying in the Nevada legislature and
working as a research staff scientist at the Lawrence Livermore
Nuclear Weapons Lab. We were studying the metal canisters and
doing pilot studies in New Mexico and in Nevada on storing nuclear
waste in these special metal alloy cans. I met a woman who was
actually a Rothschild, she told me secretly but not to tell
anyone, and she was very impressed with the work I was doing
so she went to all of the meetings there in Pahrump,
which is a little tiny town near the Nevada Test Site. She found
out that the EPA, the Environmental Protection Agency, actually
had a secret dairy at the Nevada Test Site all through nuclear
bomb testing. They were measuring the radiation in cows, in
calves, and in their own workers who shoveled manure and fed
the cattle in that dairy.
Dr. Fetzer: Oh my gosh.
L. Moret: They also had cattle herds, meat-producing
herds that they were also testing. That was classified. But
she went to town and she actually got the report declassified
and gave it to me. Another piece of evidence is that cattle
mutilation during bomb testing began to be reported and it really
turned into a very big issue in the U.S.. What a radiation activist
told me was that he walked into an office one day in the Midwest,
another activist office, about this cattle mutilation. They
had a stick pin map where they had put a stick pin for each
cattle mutilation reported across the U.S. He said they were
all down river or downwind from nuclear facilities and the sheriff
in one county actually went up to a black helicopter that had
landed at a very tiny airport down in the wildlands, the farmland
and discovered it was Army personnel with samples of tissue
from cattle, they had mutilated cattle in that area. It was
the Army taking samples from horses, cattle, killing them, and
then throwing them out of the helicopter after they had sampled
them or leaving them on the ground smelling like formaldehyde.
This has been a military operation the whole time to monitor
the health effects, the radiation levels, and the samples were
always taken in the cattle from the eyeballs, that usually has
the lowest radiation level in the body, and from the rectum
and different organs in the cattle. It was very systematic.
We also know that what happened in the bomb test period is happening
now to monitor the Fukushima radiation. What they are doing
is there is a big effort by the military and the nuclear establishment
to manipulate the vital statistics of the U.S. and other countries
by secretly aborting, forcing women with defective fetuses to
abort them, and then it is reported in the vital statistics
to the Centers for Disease Control from each county as voluntary
abortions by these women. That
keeps the birth defects and so forth out of the vital statistics
at the Centers for Disease Control. Of course these statistics
are used globally. So they are fudging everything.
Dr. Fetzer: So these people are suffering serious
genetic abnormalities but they are covering it by --
L. Moret: Yes, and they have special units
set up now in county hospitals where they are sending poor women,
native Americans, African American women, poor people and forcing
them to have abortions because the food streams in the United
States and in different populations and in different socioeconomic
groups are all also contaminated with radiation. The highest
levels are in the poor populations, the poor sector of minorities
and poor people. The best food, the cleanest food, for instance,
you can buy at Whole
Foods whether they are importing food from the Southern
Hemisphere, and they always have been since they went into operation
and became a corporation and a food provider for the U.S. So
foodstreams are also being poisoned.
Dr. Fetzer: Well just stunning. There are those
of course who surmise that this is actually something that is
being allowed to happen in order to contribute to the depopulation
of the world. One might think that presumes a rather cynical
point of view but the government really doesn't seem to be doing
anything that it could do to protect the health and welfare
of the population, the citizens of the United States in this
L. Moret: Well it is hard to believe. It is
really, really surreal. It is Orwellian. It is a nightmare.
But a very, very interesting book has been published called
political ponorology. And ponorology is the science on the nature
of evil.This particular book is addressing political purposes,
Ponorology. It is by Andrew M. Lobaczewski [and
Laura Knight-Jadczyk] who died recently, but he and a group
of scientists in Poland wrote this book about the evil politicians
during the Soviet era. The book had to be burned by him because
he was told that the Polish intelligence was coming to his house
to take it, and he and some of the scientists moved to the Soviet
Union, rewrote it, published it, the same thing happened there.
He came to the U.S. and he finally published it in his late
80's in the U.S. in about 1985 or 90, but Brzezinski
blocked it from being published. It has finally been published
and if people are interested in how things like this can happen
to humanity and to the biosphere and to this planet, it is a
very, very interesting book.
Dr. Fetzer: Leuren, on that note we are going
to have to take our break. This is Jim Fetzer, your host on
The Real Deal, with my two very special guest experts
on Fukushima, Christina Consolo and Leuren Moret. We will be
2 of 2
Dr. Fetzer: This is Jim Fetzer your host on
The Real Deal continuing and concluding my conversation
with Leuren Moret and Christina Consolo about Fukushima. I am
really at your disposal because the two of you are the experts.
I know we want to address the "28
Indications That The West Coast is Being Absolutely Fried With
Nuclear Radiation," but I leave it to your
discretion as to how we shall proceed. Leuren?
L. Moret: Sure, let's see. I think now you
can post these in your article, right? Or the transcript?
Dr. Fetzer: Yes
L. Moret: I mean we have links, we have this
article and other articles. We will send it all to you and you
can weave it into the interview.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, well Bill Fox, to whom I am
very indebted for arranging these interviews, will be preparing
transcripts of our conversations for publication as articles
in Veterans Today. He would be very pleased to include
the links to any articles you want to add, Leuren. And of course
any graphics you want to provide for the publication in VT.
L. Moret: Sure, OK, Christina how about if
we each read one of these and alternate. We read these 28
Signs on the Pacific coast of North America.
L. Moret: So the first one which we mentioned
already is [Number 1] "Polar bears, seals
and walruses along the Alaska coastline are suffering from fur
loss and open sores…" and that
has also been reported in the moose population. There is a big
moose die off from the Pacific coast to the Atlantic along the
Canadian-U.S. border. So you go ahead and do Number 2.
Christina: Number 2 is the "epidemic
of sea lion deaths along the California coastline…"
but I also want to mention they had an unusual event as far
down as San Diego this year where seal pups were being abandoned
in much greater numbers than what the rescuers were used to
seeing. They still don't have an explanation about why these
seal pups were abandoned. They were all under weight. Some of
them have been rehabilitated and put back into nature. These
events are really escalating and they are moving right up the
Dr. Fetzer: Could it be that from the evolutionary
point of view the seal population, the mothers recognize when
they have offspring that aren't likely to be capable of sustaining
their way and therefore they abandon them early to not invest
more maternal resources in their upbringing when their prospects
are so slender
Christina: It is a definite possibility.
L. Moret: The other thing that happens is that
when a population is put under stress and the young are affected
the most by toxins and so forth, and it weakens them and they
can't keep up with the mothers or they get lost or they left
behind the mothers just can't take care of them or find them
when they come back to where they thought they were. So 45%
of the pups born in June have died in Southern California along
the coast. That is a very high death rate. It is the same as
the infant mortality. When you see phenomena occurring in humans
and in animal populations it has to be an environmental
Dr. Fetzer: That is all profoundly disturbing.
L. Moret: So did you have anything else to
Christina: I did try to track someone down
at NOAA to comment
on the seal mortality and what was found in terms of the testing
for radioactive materials, because ENENews had reported over
a year ago that they did find radiation in the seals but that
it wasn't above what they expected it to be for normal background.
However they never indicated if it was for cesium or strontium
or what exactly they tested for or what the levels were. When
I tried to call NOAA to pin somebody down with this I got such
a run-around. In fact some of it I did on air on my show and
we kept getting sent to David Kelly and then I would call David
Kelly and [they would say] "Oh, you want the David Kelly
in Hawaii" and then I would call him and they would send
me to someone else. What I found out was that they actually
carved up these seals and sent them to twenty different labs
for testing. You know they sent the whiskers to one lab, then
they sent the teeth to another lab and they sent the skin from
the dorsal area to another lab. So I mean it is like the Manhattan
Project but in reverse.
L. Moret: Same thing! It is the same thing.
Christina: Where they divide up all the information
knowing that these people probably won't talk to each other
and figure out what is going on
L. Moret: Yes, that is what they are doing.
So Number 3 is "Along the Pacific coast of Canada and
the Alaska coastline, the population of sockeye salmon is at
historic low. Many are blaming Fukushima."
Certainly this woman,
she is a professional biologist has fund-raised and done a study
on the salmon in British Columbia in the Fraser
River and other rivers. This is an area where a large orca
population will summer. The resident orcas that live in a particular
area, they come and migrate and spend a whole summer there.
They usually arrive with new baby orcas, so they are feeding
them too. They live on salmon populations. The other orcas called
transient populations, they live on marine sea mammals and they
travel in groups of three so that they are quiet and can sneak
up on the sea mammals, seals and stuff. So they have very different
diets and we are going to see the effects of the radiation in
the difference in the diet in these populations over time. I
predict that the coastal salmon, the resident populations, are
going to have a more severe impact because the salmon are going
out into the Pacific, they are eating smaller fish that bioconcentrate
the radiation. We just have to wait and see. But this woman
who did this study and independently raised the money to analyze,
have these salmon lab-analyzed, they have very severe viruses
and that indicates immune system damage as well as a slimy star
fish goo. The star fish are just kind of melting along the North
Dr. Fetzer: Oh God.
L. Moret: And then the jellyfish also.So that
really sounds like a viral infection or some kind of bacterial-viral
slime on them.
Dr. Fetzer: You know the exposure to radiation
will affect their immune systems or their capacity to cope with
otherwise threats to their environment they might normally be
able to deal with and make them far more vulnerable to these
kinds of diseases and related problems.
L. Moret: Christina--
Christina: Number 4 was "Something
is causing fish all along the west coast of Canada to
bleed from their gills, bellies and eyeballs."
I mean, bleeding and bruising is a hallmark of radiation exposure
and sure there are mutations of viruses and bacteria that could
be making these fish sick. They are indicating from this article
that it is in multiple species. Now I did call several fisheries
over the last few days in Canada, one in the Great Lakes region,
Purdy's [Fish Market],
and another in the Vancouver area. Both of the people that I
spoke to at those fisheries were very forthcoming. They all
knew about Fukushima. They knew that there was a potential for
it to be affecting their catches. They did report from both
the Great Lakes region and from B.C. that they are experiencing
lows in their catch. Nothing historic, but that it was kind
of across the board. But neither organization had noted any
increase of disease. When I asked them who is testing the fish
for radiation, they said that was not their job. That happened
after the fish leave their market place.
Dr. Fetzer: After the fish leave their market
Dr. Fetzer: So they are getting into the food
chain for the human population and only then they are going
to be tested? Not likely, because the retailers are going to
want to market it and make their profit. No one cares about
the health of the consumer.
L. Moret: Well they just balkanize
countries. They balkanize the media too, so that is what is
Christina: It all needs to be tested, and Leuren
had brought up in an interview that she did last week with Alfred
Webre that I mean there is a serious economic impact to this
disaster that we are just now starting to realize. Obviously
it is going to be affecting the fishing industry pretty severely.
Dr. Fetzer: Just as has happened on the Gulf
Coast from the BP disaster, I mean it has just wiped out whole
L. Moret: What they are doing is they are out
there fishing like mad, scraping the bottom. They have these
huge nets that are a mile wide. They are just taking everything
indiscriminately and canning it, freezing it, and turning it
into human food. This is just how they spread the radiation
everywhere. They want everyone exposed, just exactly what they
are doing in Japan by burning radioactive trash all over Japan.
Number Five is "A vast field of radioactive debris
from Fukushima that is approximately
the size of California" or Texas "has
crossed the Pacific Ocean and is starting to collide with the
Dr. Fetzer: That is stunning. That's stunning!
L. Moret: That's right, and there is a very
good article, October 18th by Greg Ray in the Herald
newspaper in Australia. It is called the "Ocean
is Broken." This is by a sailor who made many
trips, yacht races across the Pacific and what he is saying
now, he sailed his boat from Osaka to San Francisco recently,
next leg of the long voyage was from Osaka to San Francisco
and for most of that trip the desolation was tinged with nauseous
horror and a degree of fear.
we left Japan, it felt as if the ocean itself was dead,"
hardly saw any living things. We saw one whale, sort of rolling
helplessly on the surface with what looked like a big tumour
on its head. It was pretty sickening.
done a lot of miles on the ocean in my life and I'm used to
seeing turtles, dolphins, sharks and big flurries of feeding
birds. But this time, for 3000 nautical miles there was nothing
alive to be seen."
place of the missing life was garbage in astounding volumes...
a lot of places we couldn't start our motor for fear of entangling
the propeller in the mass of pieces of rope and cable. That's
an unheard of situation, out in the ocean.
we did decide to motor we couldn't do it at night, only in
the daytime with a lookout on the bow, watching for rubbish.
the bow, in the waters above Hawaii, you could see right down
into the depths. I could see that the debris isn't just on
the surface, it's all the way down. And it's all sizes, from
a soft-drink bottle to pieces the size of a big car or truck.
saw a factory chimney sticking out of the water, with some
kind of boiler thing still attached below the surface. We
saw a big container-type thing, just rolling over and over
on the waves.
were weaving around these pieces of debris. It was like sailing
through a garbage..." [pile].
L. Moret: That is reality. That is what is
Dr. Fetzer: Christina --
Christina: Number 6: "It is being
projected that the radioactivity of coastal waters off the U.S.
west coast could
double over the next five to six years."
Dr. Fetzer: I'll bet sooner.
Christina: I think that is being pretty generous.
I think it is going to happen sooner.
Dr. Fetzer: Much too conservative.
Christina: There are many things that need
to be taken into account. How much radioactivity might be carried
from this debris. Much of it is porous. Cloth and styrofoam
and wood that is going to collect particles that have been raining
out over the past two and a half years. Then we also have a
situation of uranium buckey balls and now the newest finding,
cesium buckey balls. That was just reported today. Leuren can
explain a little bit more about that, but we don't know how
those things travel in the ocean waters.
L. Moret: Yes, scientists are reporting that
spheres of radioactive material from Fukushima are being reported
for the first time. Ball-like particles composed of cesium,
iron, zinc, solid [Ed. Note: she probably meant "soluble"]
and insoluble in water, [the] impact on human health need to
be examined. What they are talking about are nanoparticles.
They are produced, these spherical particles, I know all about
this because depleted uranium is just like this. This indicates
since these are being reported now, very recently, as a new
phenomenon, it means that the fuel rods are burning in Fukushima
at extremely high temperatures. It means there is no water in
the pools or some of the pools. What happens at these very high
temperatures is that they are so high the burning fuel rods
release a gas, a very hot gas, that condenses and collects as
a spherical radioactive particle when the very hot gas begins
to chill. That indicates that Fukushima fuel rods are definitely
burning at extremely high temperatures, and that was not reported
right after the Fukushima earthquake and tsunami. So that place
is going in flames and releasing extremely radioactive, very,
very dangerous spherical nanoparticles of mixed radioactive
isotopes and those tiny spheres are extremely dangerous because
they have an effect called the particulate effect. They actually
change chemicals and interfere with cell processes that are
life-threatening and cause very high rates of various illnesses
caused by ionizing radiation. But there is our proof right there
that Fukushima is on fire.
Dr. Fetzer: Unbelievable
Christina: I have a question. Leuren, have
you ever heard of this type of nanoparticle before in a reactor
L. Moret: No.
Christina: I haven't either
L. Moret: No, I haven't either. But it is definitely
characteristic of depleted uranium from the battlefield. Uranium
is a pyrophoric metal. It catches on fire very, very easily
and it burns at temperatures up to 5,000 degrees centigrade
which is hotter than the sun! So these tiny particles are the
most lethal part of the danger of a nuclear power plant burning
or using depleted uranium weapons. Of course we know at Fukushima
that they have MOX fuel in one of the reactors. That is mixing
plutonium and uranium in the fuel and it is very unstable. It
burns at very high temperatures. Of course plutonium is extremely
lethal to living organisms.
Dr. Fetzer: Christina --
Christina: Number 7, "Experts have
high levels of cesium-137 in plankton living in
the waters of the Pacific Ocean between Hawaii and the west
Dr. Fetzer: Oh, that is not normal, hunh?
Christina: Well you know they detected two
weeks after the accident already very high levels in the kelp
off B.C., and at that time it was I-131 I believe which after
40 days dissipates, but I-129 sticks around for much longer.
I have an article called "The Bioaccumulation of Contamination
in Plankton." This is from the U.S. Armed Forces in 1955.
Plankton concentrate mineral elements from the water and it
has been found that radioactivity may be concentrated in this
manner by as much as a thousand times. Thus,
for example, one gram of plankton could contain a thousand times
as much radioactivity as a gram of water adjacent to it.
Dr. Fetzer: Unreal.
Christina: And I believe we know even more
now than we did back then, but I mean this is bad news for anything
in the ocean that lives on plankton, which is everything. But
things that feed directly on it like whales.
L. Moret: It is the base of the food chain.
What we know about bioaccumulation in seaweed is that seaweed
bioconcentrates ionizing radiation in the seawater to 150,000
times higher levels in seaweed than in the water the seaweed
is living in.
Dr. Fetzer: Unbelievable.
L. Moret: So Number 8: "One test in
California found that 15
out of 15 bluefin
tuna were contaminated with radiation from Fukushima."
That was just about a year ago when tuna off the coast of San
Diego were sampled and I think all of them had cesium in the
flesh and these tuna had come from Japan which is where they
spawn offshore from Fukushima.
Dr. Fetzer: Christina --
Christina: Yes, Number 9 ties into that too
"Back in 2012, the Vancouver Sun reported that cesium-137
was being found in a
very high percentage of the fish that Japan was
selling to Canada…
percent of mackerel tested
91 percent of the halibut
92 percent of the sardines"
[Interjecting] Of course now the sardines from here
have disappeared. [Continues to read from the article].
"93 percent of the tuna and eel
94 percent of the cod and anchovies
100 percent of the carp, seaweed, shark and monkfish"
Fetzer: A 100%!
L. Moret: One hundred percent, and that is
because the levels in these different fish depend on their diet,
so fish that prey on other fish usually have lower levels than
fish that feed on plankton, for instance, or they are bottom
feeders and they pick up mud and small particles which have
higher levels of radiation because of the chemical affinity
that tiny particles have for radiation. In other words, very
tiny clay particles in water are scavengers for highly charged
Dr. Fetzer: Continue--.
L. Moret: [Number] 10: "Canadian authorities
are finding extremely
high levels of nuclear radiation in certain fish
fish samples tested to date have had very high levels of radiation:
one sea bass sample collected in July, for example, had 1,000
Moret [Interjecting] that means disintegrations per
second. [Continues to read from the article]
kilogram of cesium."
Moret: Now the terrible thing about cesium is that
if affects the heart. It is collected in the heart. The heart
produces new cells only about 5% per year. So we are seeing
athletes, race horses, celebrities during performance, pilots
while they are flying are collapsing, they are dying of heart
attacks or cardiac failure. This is being very widely reported
in the U.S. and Alaska flight crews and also in England football
players, race horses. That is the cesium damage. Now what people
don't realize is that nearly 2,000 radioactive isotopes are
produced in a fissioning process and that is what is coming
out of the fuel rods so you have to multiply the danger of the
cesium they are reporting by almost two thousand other isotopes.
We are getting absolutely bombarded.
Dr. Fetzer: If I pick up on Number 11, people
developing cancer from eating contaminated fish, why I am stunned
by this is it seems to be having such a rapid effect. I mean,
here we have this Daniel Hirsh, a nuclear policy lecturer at
UC Santa Cruz who is telling Global Security Newswire “We
could have large numbers of cancer from ingestion of fish'”
and I take it they are already showing up. [Editor's
Note: Number 11 reads as follows:] "Some
experts believe that we could see very high levels of cancer
along the west coast just
from people eating contaminated fish…"
at what’s going on now: They’re dumping huge amounts
of radioactivity into the ocean — no one expected that
in 2011,” Daniel Hirsch, a nuclear policy lecturer at
the University of California-Santa Cruz, told Global Security
Newswire. “We could have large numbers of cancer from
ingestion of fish.'”
L. Moret: It is already showing up
Dr. Fetzer: How quickly? You know it is just
astonishing that it should be that fast.
Christina: Well you know part of the problem
too is that when you look back at Chernobyl, in Japan they are
saying right now all these kids that they are finding thyroid
problems with, you know, they are developing nodules, some of
them have early cancer. -- the experts are saying this can't
be from Fukushima because it is happening too fast, because
in Chernobyl it took four or five years for a hundred kids to
L. Moret: Well it is these very tiny particles
and it is constant exposure now for two years, more than two
years. Chernobyl was just one exposure, and they put the lid
on it. They put a sarcophagus on it and stopped it. This is
constant, daily, 24 hour a day releases of low level and not
so low level radiation. By April of 2011, just two months after
Fukushima, air samples and air filters in cars were analyzed
by Dr. Chris Busby. He calculated that by April the radiation
concentrations in the air in Japan around the Fukushima area
indicated that the equivalent of 300 Chernobyls had occurred.
We are talking now from this new evidence about spherical particles,
we are talking about all those fuel rods, or large numbers of
fuel rods in the cooling pools that are now empty are releasing
huge new amounts of extremely toxic sphericals.
Dr. Fetzer: Unbelievable.
L. Moret: So it is really bad and a new study
by the Radiation and Food Lab, I believe it is in Japan, they
reported that the 19th of October 2013, that Pacific Coast seaweed
is contaminated with cesium and that the levels are 8.14 becquerels
per kilo for Cs-134, 8.88 becquerels per kilo for Cs-137, and
cobalt is even being reported in seaweed off the Pacific Coast
of the U.S. at 3.7 becquerels per kilo. In Chiba, which is north,
is between Tokyo and Fukushima, the cesium levels were 41 becquerels
per kilo for Cs -134, 63 becquerels per kilo for Cs-137, and
although no cobalt
60 was detected, but there is nothing to compare this to.
You cannot even compare it to Chernobyl. The spent fuel rods
did not burn at Chernobyl. It was just the reactor rods and
they stopped it right away. But these people in Japan are releasing,
they are guaranteeing, they are facilitating increased releases
of extremely high levels of radiation on a daily basis into
the atmosphere and into the ocean and off course contaminated
air masses are over here along the Pacific Coast line in a matter
Dr. Fetzer: Christina, could you take 12, 13,
Christina: Sure. Number 12 is the "BBC
News recently reported that radiation levels around Fukushima
times higher' than previously believed." And,
you know, again
it is TEPCO's numbers which are always revised higher. With
the last few weeks where we have had kind of this escalation
of events, one of the things that I found really curious is
that because of a wall that was built underground to block the
corium from going out into the sea , or highly contaminated
water going out into the sea, effectively they have dammed up
the site, so the ground is now becoming saturated. If you have
this underground corium lava field under the reactors, you have
ground water that is flowing through the site and you have water
that is continuously being poured on the reactors, and they
are only collecting 300 or 400 tons of that a day, I think what
we are going to see eventually is that this corium-ground water
combination is going to be coming up around this site. At that
point workers are not going to be able to be there. There is
no way to protect them especially from tritium because tritium
will go through everything. So they are really under the gun
for anything that they need to do. They are going to cycle through
workers continuously. There is no way to keep people on the
site for long term with the kind of exposures they are getting
with these numbers that we are seeing.
[Editor's Note: Numbers 13 and 14, which were skipped in this
interview, read as follows:]
study concluded that Fukushima released up to
210 quadrillion becquerels of cesium-137 into the atmosphere."
radiation from Fukushima reached the west coast of the United
a few days back in 2011."
Fetzer: Leuren, how about 15, 16 and 17?
L. Moret: [Number 15]: "At this point,
tons of contaminated water is pouring into the
Pacific Ocean from Fukushima every single day." That
is because Japan is an island arc. The nuclear power plants
are built on the coastline so they can use sea water, huge amounts
of water every day to cool the reactors. The run off from the
volcanic spine of Japan is running right down to the coastline
and it is washing straight through Fukushima in that location
and just carrying a constant river of radioactive water washing
into the sea. Number 16: "A senior researcher of marine
chemistry at the Japan Meteorological Agency’s Meteorological
Research Institute says that `30 billion becquerels of radioactive
cesium and 30 billion becquerels of radioactive strontium' are
being released into the Pacific Ocean from Fukushima every
single day." I bet it is a lot more than
that. Number 17: "According to Tepco, a total of somewhere
trillion and 40 trillion becquerels of radioactive tritium..."
[Leuren Moret interjects] radioactive tritium is radioactive
water, basically, "...have gotten into the Pacific
Ocean since the Fukushima disaster first began."
Dr. Fetzer: Christina, 18, 19, and 20.
Christina: [Number 18:] "According
to a professor at Tokyo University, 3 gigabecquerels of cesium-137
are flowing into the port at Fukushima Daiichi every
single day." Again, that is just one
isotope. It is just cesium 137. Number 19: "It has
been estimated that up to 100
times as much nuclear radiation has been released
into the ocean from Fukushima than was released during the entire
Chernobyl disaster." Leuren just covered that when
she talked about Chris
Busby's air filter studies.
L. Moret: That is under estimation
Dr. Fetzer: Yes. [Number] 20 --
Christina: [Number] 20:
"One recent study concluded that a very large plume of
cesium-137 from the Fukushima disaster will start flowing into
U.S. coastal waters early
simulations showed that the plume of radioactive cesium-137
released by the Fukushima disaster in 2011 could begin flowing
into U.S. coastal waters starting in early 2014 and peak in
There are so many unknowns.
L. Moret: It is going to kill the oceans. It
absolutely is, the coastline [too].
Dr. Fetzer: Leuren, go to 21 and 22.
L. Moret: OK, [Number] 21 "It is
being projected that significant levels of cesium-137 will reach
every corner of the Pacific Ocean by
the year 2020." That is because the ocean
is very dynamic and that stuff is spread all over, very rapidly,
but not as rapidly as in the atmosphere. [Number] 22: "It
is being projected that the entire Pacific Ocean will soon `have
cesium levels 5 to 10 times higher' than what we
witnessed during the era of heavy atomic bomb testing in the
Pacific many decades ago." That is going to absolutely
kill the fish populations.
Dr. Fetzer: Christina: 23, 24.
Christina: [Number 23:] "The
immense amounts of nuclear radiation getting into the water
in the Pacific Ocean has caused environmental activist Joe Martino
to issue the
days of eating Pacific Ocean fish are over.'”
Mine were over two years ago! [Laughter]
Dr. Fetzer: Smart. You were ahead of the curve.
Christina: [Number] 24 is
"The Iodine-131, Cesium-137 and Strontium-90 that are constantly
coming from Fukushima are going to affect the health of those
living the the northern hemisphere for a very, very long time.
Just consider what Harvey
Wasserman had to say about this…
for example, can be ingested into the thyroid, where it emits
beta particles (electrons) that damage tissue. A plague of
damaged thyroids has already been reported among as many as
40 percent of the children in the Fukushima area. That percentage
can only go higher. In developing youngsters, it can stunt
both physical and mental growth. Among adults it causes a
very wide range of ancillary ailments, including cancer.
from Fukushima has been found in fish caught as far away as
California. It spreads throughout the body, but tends to accumulate
in the muscles.
half-life is around 29 years. It mimics calcium and goes to
Fetzer: Leuren, 25 and 26.
L. Moret: [Number] 25:
"According to a recent Planet
Infowars report, the California coastline is being
transformed into “a dead zone”…
California coastline is becoming like a dead zone.
you haven’t been to a California beach lately, you probably
don’t know that the rocks are unnaturally CLEAN –
there’s hardly any kelp, barnacles, sea urchins, etc.
Fetzer: [Interjecting] Killing all the microscopic
forms of life?
L. Moret: Yes.. [Continuing to read from the
the tide pools are similarly eerily devoid of crabs, snails
and other scurrying signs of life…
Moret: In other words, these filter feeders that are
taking in very high levels and bioconcentrating them are just
not able to survive. Especially compared to ten to fifteen years
ago when you had to wear tennis shoes if you went to the beach
or you would cut the heck out of the bottom of your feet. Life
is being exterminated. The ocean is going extinct.
[Editor's Note: the following is the remainder of Number 25]
especially as compared to 10 – 15 years ago when one
was wise to wear tennis shoes on a trip to the beach in order
to avoid cutting one’s feet on all the STUFF of life
– broken shells, bones, glass, driftwood, etc.
are also days when I am hard-pressed to find even a half dozen
seagulls and/or terns on the county beach.
can still find a few gulls trolling the picnic areas and some
of the restaurants (with outdoor seating areas) for food,
of course, but, when I think back to 10 – 15 years ago,
the skies and ALL the beaches were literally filled with seagulls
and the haunting sound of their cries both day and night…"
it’s unnaturally quiet."
L. Moret: Then it is carried into the Atlantic
Ocean and it will happen there, in the Arctic Ocean, and around
the Antarctic. They are killing the entire global ocean.
Dr. Fetzer: 26
Christina: [Number] 26 is "A study
last year came to the conclusion that radiation
from the Fukushima nuclear disaster could negatively affect
human life along the west coast of North America from Mexico
to Alaska `for decades.'”
Dr. Fetzer: Leuren, 27
L. Moret: [Number] 27. "According
to the Wall Street Journal, it is being projected that the cleanup
of Fukushima could take up
to 40 years to complete." It is never
going to stop releasing in our life time.
Dr. Fetzer: I agree. 28, Christina.
Christina: [Number 28:] "Yale Professor
Charles Perrow is warning that if the cleanup of Fukushima is
not handled with 100% precision that humanity could be threatened
thousands of years'…" He is referring
to the fuel extraction in part which is scheduled to start in
15 days from Reactor 4. They actually are currently
moving fuel from reactor 6 into the common spent fuel pool.
Now they began that in Mid-October but it took them three weeks
just to pry off the reactor lid in Reactor 6, and that reactor
was supposed to be fine. It did not have any damage that was
reported. If they found anything once they got inside that reactor
they haven't talked about it. But they are currently moving
that fuel and they are going to be moving the fuel from Number
4 at the same time around the end of November.
[Editor's Note: The remainder of Number 28 reads:]
in the unit 4 pool, 100 feet from the ground, are perilous,
and if any two of the rods touch it could cause a nuclear
reaction that would be uncontrollable. The radiation emitted
from all these rods, if they are not continually cool and
kept separate, would require the evacuation of surrounding
areas including Tokyo. Because of the radiation at the site
the 6,375 rods in the common storage pool could not be continuously
cooled; they would fission and all of humanity will
be threatened, for thousands of years.'”
Fetzer: In the minutes we have that remain I would
like your concluding reflections, Christina?
Christina: Well I think this is an issue of
enormous complexity. It is difficult to really wrap your mind
around it even if you do nothing else but read about this problem
day after day. I know many people that have. Fukushima has changed
their lives because they realized right from the beginning the
magnitude of the disaster. For people who are kind of overwhelmed
by this, the only thing you have to remember is that all radiation
is bad. Everything that you can do to eliminate it in your daily
life is good for the long run, because it is cumulative. You
kind of have to treat yourself like you are already a cancer
patient and get lots of sleep and eat well and pay attention
to the people who are talking about this because it is really
is probably the most important issue that we have ever faced.
Dr. Fetzer: Leuren, summing up in a sentence
L. Moret: Well, the effects of these nuclear
technologies that have been introduced one after another it
actually has resulted in very strange phenomenon and that is
that the oldest people in the U.S., the seniors and those over
60, are the healthiest part of the U.S. population now, and
the younger populations are having worse and worse health histories
and health effects and as time goes on and they become adults
all that exposure in the womb is expressed later on in their
health. The highest increase in death rates after Fukushima
was reported in basically the soldiers who returned to Texas
from the battlefields of Iraq and Afghanistan. They are the
most exposed. They are already carrying a body burden and it
has almost killed them and that little bit of Fukushima radiation
just was the last straw.
Dr. Fetzer: Leuren Moret and Christina Consolo,
I can't thank you enough for being here on The Real Deal
with me, even though what you are telling us is overwhelming,
depressing, even catastrophic. I can't thank you enough.